Post by WalksInSpirit on Sept 12, 2005 15:17:26 GMT -5
Astrology Chat: 09-12-05
(01:30:32) (ron) WISE MEN FROM THE EAST: THE REST OF THE STORY
(01:30:55) (ron) "We three Kings of Orient are, bearing gifts we travel afar...," and so go the lyrics to the popular Christmas carol with which we are so familiar. It was written of course to commemorate the arrival of the Magi, or Wise Men, at the birth of the Christ Child. However, according to the Cayce readings, these visitors were not really kings and
(01:31:24) (ron) there were more than three of them, arriving in several different groups from at least five different countries. In addition, although the modern Church celebrates their visitation on January 6, Cayce tells us that they were not
(01:33:09) (ron) some missing
(01:33:17) (ron) However, according to the Cayce readings, these visitors were not really kings and there were more than three of them, arriving in several different groups from at least five different countries. In addition, although the modern Church celebrates their visitation on January 6, Cayce tells us that they were not
(01:33:55) (ron) actually presented to the Child until after the time of Mary's purification in accordance with Jewish Law (29 to 40 days after birth). (5749-7)
(01:34:34) (ron) Cayce's expanded story comes together over multiple readings, including two in which individuals were told that they had been the Wise Men of the Nativity story in previous lives. In Cayce's narrative, the true purpose and meaning of the gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh is explained, and we are even told why one group was routed
(01:34:52) (Q) wouldn't that also mean after Jesus was taken to be seen at the church also.. the first male child given as a consecration to God.
(01:35:06) (ron) through Herod rather than directly to the Christ Child. The readings also point out that the Wise Men's visit served to provide encouragement and support to Mary and those around her.
(01:35:43) (ron) WHAT THE BIBLE TELLS US
(01:36:43) (ron) that the tradition of the number three was taken from the number of gifts given (gold, frankincense, and myrrh). The Cayce readings indicate that there may have been as many as five different groups arriving before, during, and after the birth (although none were presented until the proper time).
(01:37:23) (ron) We are told in the Scriptures that the Magi had received a revelation of sorts and were following a star that they believed would lead them to the newly born "King of the Jews." For some reason they stopped in Jerusalem to inquire of the Child's whereabouts. Herod, the current head of the Jewish government under the Romans, felt
(01:37:57) (ron) immediately threatened and conspired with his chief scribes to use the Magi to locate this potential rival. The Magi, however, were directed in a dream not to return to Herod with the information. As a result, Herod ordered
(01:38:24) (ron) the death of all children in the area under the age of two years. Joseph, warned in a dream to flee with the Child to Egypt, escaped with the family.
(01:38:44) (ron) WERE THE WISE MEN SPIRITUAL ADEPTS?
(01:39:11) (ron) Although Bible scholars believe that the Wise Men came from Persia, Matthew's gospel does not specify the country of origin, just that they came from the East. Cayce states specifically that "They came from Persia, India, Egypt, and also from Chaldea, Gobi (China), and what is NOW the Indo or Tao land." (2067-7) Asimov's Guide to
(01:39:44) (ron) the New Testament states that the Persian priests of the ancient Zoroastrian religion were called "magu," which in Latin becomes "magi." This is particularly interesting, since the Cayce readings indicate that a previous incarnation of the Christ soul was Zend, the father of Zoroaster.
(01:40:31) (ron) The Jewish Encyclopedia tells us that the term magi was given to magicians from the Babylonian and Egyptian religions. The practice of magic was common throughout ancient Israel and the Middle East, especially among scholars. So-called white magic was differentiated from black magic (sorcery and worship of false gods) and was
(01:41:04) (ron) used primarily to counteract the latter form or for healing. "It was, however, only the practice of witchcraft that was prohibited, for a knowledge of magic was indispensable to a member of the chief councilor of the judiciary..."
(01:41:45) (ron) It appears that white magic may have been a blanket term given to practices we would today list under psychic ability. In the Talmud, for example, Jesus is regarded as a magician. It is also noted that portions of these traditions, although condemned by some Hebrew factions, are said to be contained in the Kabala teachings.
(01:42:39) (ron) In the life readings for the former Wise Men, Cayce describes them as being both very spiritual and very intelligent and as having skills in astrology, astronomy, and mathematics. (256-1; 1908-1) They were spiritual seekers who were very much aware of the Hebrew Messianic prophecies. In one reading, Cayce refers to the Wise Men as
(01:43:18) (ron) "...those that subdued - not that were ruled by, but subdued the understandings of that in the earth - were considered, or were in the position of the wise, or the sages, or the ones that were holy; in body and mind, in
(01:43:40) (ron) accord with purposes." He further indicates that they found their way to the Christ Child "...in and through the application of those forces - as ye would term today psychic" (5749-7)
(01:44:16) (ron) ESSENCE RECORDS HIDDEN IN PYRAMID
(01:45:04) (ron) Cayce also tells us that the Wise Men had spent time studying records of ancient wisdom kept in Egypt. It was from these records that they knew about the coming of the Messiah and the preparations made by a Jewish sect known as the Essenes. (1010-17) An Essene teacher by the name of Judy was in charge of the records. She sent the
(01:45:41) (ron) first group of Wise Men to Herod in an attempt to undermine his relationship with the Romans and thus topple him from his throne. Her plan backfired and ultimately caused the death of many innocent children. As a result, she was told that, in this lifetime, she had to learn not to sit in judgment of others, regardless of their sins. (1472-3)
(01:45:54) (ron) that is informative
(01:46:02) (ron) to undermine
(01:46:47) (ron) Both Judy and another Essene teacher, Josie, were responsible for assisting in Jesus' education during his studies in Egypt, Persia and India. In fact, a reading given in July of 1932 asserts that records of this training were located in
(01:47:11) (ron) a pyramid "yet to be uncovered," and that the records might come to light between 1936 and 1940, "When there has been sufficient of the reckoning through which the world is passing in the present..." (5749-2)
(01:47:43) (ron) The readings also seem to indicate that these records contain the information studied by the Wise Men. Some have speculated that the 13 papyrus books found in Nag Hammadi, Egypt, in 1945 and/or the Dead Sea Scrolls, discovered shortly thereafter, could be the information to which Cayce was referring. Cayce also indicated that
(01:48:02) (ron) Blu and WIS ...there you go
(01:48:33) (ron) Herod's wife, who had contact with both the Essenes and the Wise Men, had written a history of this time period, which was lost with the destruction of the Alexandria library. (2067-1) In his recent book, An American Prophet, Sidney Kirkpatrick states that portions of this narrative may still exist in the Vatican Library.
(01:49:16) (ron) THE MEANING OF THE GIFTS
(01:49:39) (ron) In one reading, regarding the training of the Christ Child by the Essenes, Cayce was asked, "What relation was there in the training with the three wise men?" His answer was that the presentation of the gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh by the Magi was a highly significant ritual, which prefigured the future development of
(01:50:09) (ron) Jesus and his initiation into his ministry later in life. "So they represent in the metaphysical sense the three phases of man's experience in materiality; gold, the material; frankincense, the ether or ethereal; myrrh, the healing force as brought with same; or body, mind, soul." (5749-7)
(01:50:57) (ron) Charles Filmore notes in the Metaphysical Dictionary that the Wise Men are archetypal symbols which represent "the wisdom that is carried within the soul from previous incarnations. They are the inner realms of consciousness that, like books of life, have kept the records of past lives and held them in reserve for the great day when the soul
(01:51:26) (ron) would receive the supreme ego, Jesus." In other words, they represent our higher self and our inner essence or individuality, as Cayce termed it. This inner wisdom serves to encourage and support our preparation for the birth of the Christ Consciousness into our limited consciousness.
(01:52:07) (ron) WHAT HAPPENED TO THE WISE MEN?
(01:52:33) (ron) The Cayce CDROM contains a magazine excerpt from 1967 recounting the Church tradition that the Wise Men were baptized by St. Thomas in India 40 years after Bethlehem. They were subsequently ordained as Christian priests and eventually martyred for their faith. Their bodies were supposedly buried in the mosque of St. Sophia at
(01:53:06) (ron) Constantinople, later moved to a Cathedral in Milan, Italy, and then to Cologne, Germany. The Dictionary of Saints by John Delaney notes a first century tradition identifying the three Magi as Balthasar, Caspar, and
(01:53:27) (ron) Melchior. They were believed to be astrologers from Babylonia and Arabia and have been deemed the patron saints of travelers.
(01:54:05) (ron) THE END...i have another on the Signs again
(01:54:11) (ron) take a break
(01:54:35) (Blu) ok! Thanks Ron!
(01:55:01) (Whiteraven) Wow rRon thank you for that I love hearing the deeper meanings thnak youfor sahring the understandings
(01:55:19) (ron) thanks WR...appreciate that
(01:55:37) (Whiteraven) y wellcome
(01:57:06) (ron) well, since things are quiet here...i'll move on
(01:57:11) (Whiteraven) ok
(01:57:40) (ron) THE TWELVE SCHOOLS AND CHALLENGES OF LIFE
(01:58:11) (ron) ARIES - "I am"
(01:58:36) (ron) The challenge of Aries is coming to a right relationship to self, and understanding one's true identity. Is your identity in your personality, body, what you do, or the content of consciousness; or is it as the "I", the consciousness, the chooser, the soul, the spiritual being?
(01:59:09) (ron) Key lessons are coordination, conversion of energy and completion.
(01:59:30) (ron) or, to finish what you have started
(01:59:45) (ron) TAURUS - "I have"
(02:00:10) (ron) The key challenge of Taurus is coming to a right relationship to the things you have or possessions. Is your identity in the things you have, or do you have the proper involvement but detachment?
(02:00:37) (ron) GEMINI - "I think"
(02:00:48) (ron) The key challenge in Gemini is developing a right relationship to your mind. Are you master of your mind, or is your mind your master/.'Gemini deals with the twins, the dual force of opposition between heavenly and earthly energies. The lesson is to harmonize one's spiritual an earthly life.
(02:01:20) (ron) CANCER - "I feel"
(02:01:33) (ron) The key challenge here is to develop a right relationship to one's feelings or emotions. Is there the understanding that it is your thoughts that cause your feelings and emotions? Are your feelings and emotions under your control or are they running you?
(02:02:20) (ron) LEO "I will"
(02:02:40) (ron) The key challenge here is in developing a right relationship to the use of will or power in one's life. Is power used in a top dog manner for dominion over others and to keep self always in the limelight? Or can power and will be used in a spiritual manner for unconditional love, equality, and for the highest good of all concerned?
(02:03:30) (ron) The key lessons of the Leo are impersonal love, coming from the heart, detachment, and serving the Spiritual Self rather than the ego self.
(02:03:57) (ron) ( Just as writing this I hear on TV - "the Trout is the perfect hunter - master of realm. Only one way to catch it - turn power of hunter against himself - entice the trout’s instincts to strike - with a fly. But then prey fights back - hook: power without caution is death" ) 8:15pm 12/01/02 Sky One UK
(02:04:14) (Q) i thought detachment might belong to Cancer for material gains.
(02:04:33) (ron) VIRGO - “I analyze”
(02:04:51) (ron) The key challenge of Virgo is developing a right relationship to analyzing mind. In its proper usage there is the ability to correlate, digest, and collect facts in service of a spiritual purpose.
(02:05:14) (ron) The key lesson is being more loving rather than negative and critical.
(02:05:32) (ron) LIBRA - "I balance"
(02:05:49) (ron) The key challenge of Libra is the balancing of inner and outer worlds. The sign of Libra focuses on relationships. There is the need to be involved with life but not lose self in a relationship or life in general.
(02:06:15) (ron) Positive: friendly, outgoing, conscientious, just, will to do good, cooperative, focus on marriage, love, cohesiveness, travel, diplomatic.
(02:06:33) (ron) Danger Areas are: people pleaser, and seeking approval from others, dominating underneath.
(02:06:52) (ron) SCORPIO - "I Create"
(02:07:07) (ron) The key challenge of Scorpio is developing a right relationship to one's creative energies. Do your creative energies serve your personality or egotistical self, or Higher-Spiritual - self?
(02:07:30) (ron) SAGITTARIUS - "I Perceive"
(02:07:40) (ron) The key challenge here is the development of intuition and understanding of the higher mind and spiritual aspects of life.
(02:07:56) (ron) Friendly, outgoing, optimistic, extroverted, sports, gambling, takes chances, independent, future focused, travel, direct.
(02:08:11) (ron) Lower: Superficial, procrastination, nervous, tactless
(02:08:29) (ron) CAPRICORN - "I Use"
(02:08:44) (ron) Developing a Right Relationship to how you use things and people in life. The positive aspect would be, how can I use this to help others as well as myself.
(02:09:05) (ron) AQUARIUS - "I know"
(02:09:19) (ron) The key challenge of Aquarius is developing that deeper inner knowing that goes beyond faith.
(02:09:36) (ron) PISCES - "I believe"
(02:09:46) (ron) The key challenge of Pisces is coming to a right relationship to self and God in terms of one's beliefs.
(02:10:33) (ron) these notes i picked up from somewhere...not very informative but might have been of some interest
(02:10:48) (ron) end
(02:11:02) (ron) THE END...OPEN CHAT
(02:11:19) (Q) direct.. optimistic.. friendly.. and Superficial.. c'mon..
(02:11:51) (Q) i thought this was kinda neat information ron. really.
(02:12:06) (WalksInSpirit) Coolness, Ron! I think the descriptions fit perfectly! I know the Virgo (Blu), Libra (me), Scorpio (My sis Debbie), and the Pisces (my sis Joanie) all fit perfectly!
(02:12:38) (Whiteraven) yup thatwas uncannily accurate fo rme
(02:12:42) (Whiteraven) thanks ron
(02:13:31) (Q) maybe edgy would be better than nervous.. but Superficial. what a bummer yang to my yin.
(02:13:33) (ron) i can go off topic as well regarding such topics regarding eastern thought on the Kundaline, Enlightenment...etc
(02:14:16) (Q) oh.. yin in the femenate form right?
(02:14:24) (ron) i have much more indepth interpretations...including the mythical backgrounds
(02:16:10) (ron) do you guys want more?
(02:16:22) (Q) yeah..
(02:16:27) (WalksInSpirit) Yep, Ron!
(02:17:25) (ron) [1]ENLIGHTENMENT
(02:17:38) (ron) this is off topic
(02:17:59) (ron) Enlightenment does not involve simply the perception that the person is only a concept. It means that all conceptualization is ended; all images and representations in the mind, whether conscious, preconscious or unconscious, are eliminated, or at least not identified with. When this profound stillness of the mind is achieved, it
(02:18:29) (ron) is asserted; true reality is perceived, not by an entity which is a separate individual. The experience is one of unqualified Being, wordless existence, infinite and eternal. (The Pearl Beyond Price, pg 27)
(02:19:06) (ron) Actually, there is no universal or agreed upon definition, or even understanding, of the concept of enlightenment. Different traditions use the word differently. Different teachers refer to different realities when they use it. And most people have not the vaguest idea what they are talking about when referring to enlightenment. Sometimes
(02:19:36) (ron) enlightenment means the attainment of a certain stage of Being. Sometimes it refers to a certain insight, perception or understanding. Sometimes it refers to a certain stage of inner development, usually the final stage, which becomes problematic since different traditions take different conditions to be the final stage. Sometimes it signifies
(02:19:42) (Q) Be-ing or Is ness.
(02:20:15) (Q) Thus ness.
(02:20:21) (ron) the transcendence of ego, other times the death of ego, still other times the transformation of ego... The concept can be useful only in a teaching that defines it very specifically. But we cannot use the concept assuming it means the same thing in all teachings or traditions. (The Pearl Beyond Price, pg 182)
(02:21:06) (ron) Some people think that enlightenment is when all your problems end. Enlightenment is really when your problems start. Enlightenment is partly the realization that you are responsible in your life, that your life is completely your
(02:21:26) (ron) i can agree to that :)
(02:21:48) (Q) ignorance is bliss.
(02:21:48) (ron) responsibility, and you are the one who really has to live it. You have to live life the way you know you ought to do it. It’s not going to just happen. (Diamond Heart Book 4, pg 79)
(02:22:17) (ron) [2]THE 10 CAUSEES OF SPIRITUAL ENLIGHTENMENT
(02:22:40) (ron) "Enlightenment is a process of peeling back the many layers of your Infinite Self. It is an opening of your being, to the entire Universe! In the center of this spiritual cyclone called life, there is a deep stillness. In the very center of this center is where true spiritual knowledge resides. This is the core of your innermost being. By continuously
(02:23:12) (ron) resting in the quiet peaceful still center in the heart of your being, you will eventually awaken. Abide in this center and you will find yourself manifesting a rich life, full of meaning, clarity, depth and bliss." -Jafree