Post by WalksInSpirit on Jan 23, 2007 22:47:18 GMT -5
Healing Stones Chat: 01-22-07
(09:26:07) (Cris) Our program tonight is Birthstones
(09:26:28) (Cris) Lord and Protector of all please be with us on our spiritual journey as we seek a higher plane of thought. Let us see opportunity to work in your grace as we come together to seek peace in this world. Amen
(09:26:42) (Bill) Amen
(09:26:42) (Blu) Amen
(09:26:42) (WalksInSpirit) Nunwe
(09:26:50) (mark) Amen
(09:26:56) (Rosie) Awomen
(09:28:29) (Cris) Birthstones were and are used today as power stones by many people
(09:28:51) (Cris) Quite often the birthstone is one of the first purchased in jewelry
(09:30:00) (Cris) The first part of this will be some background through the ages
(09:30:49) (Cris) If you have questions feel free to interupt
(09:31:06) (Cris) Let all of us know if you have input
(09:31:10) (Cris) In the past some people originally chose gemstones to wear based on its color and the magical or healing powers associated with that color. The color green, for instance, was associated with spring. Spring and green symbolized faith and fertility. Emerald then became one of the green stones representing spring, a time of birth.
(09:31:31) (Cris) Because of the meanings attached to green, people began using emeralds to help lessen the pains of childbirth. (Gemstones for the other seasons are ruby for Summer, sapphire for Autumn, and diamond for Winter.)
(09:31:59) (Rosie) interesting!
(09:34:01) (Cris) Gemstone folklore later came from legends and mythology. An example of this was the perception that amethyst prevented drunkenness. That belief started with a Greek myth about the wine god, Bacchus. Amethyst was a beautiful and innocent young woman condemned to die by Bacchus. The goddess Diana turned Amethyst into a white crystal to protect her from Bacchus. Bacchus poured wine on the crystal, staining it purple.
(09:34:44) (Cris) This next bit will go along with last night's class from Bill
(09:34:59) (Cris) About 1300 B.C. some gemstones acquired religious significance. In Exodus 28:17-21, specific gemstones were associated with each of the twelve tribes of Israel. People of Jewish heritage may choose their birthstones based on their tribal names.
(09:35:20) (Cris) Historians have complied several lists of which stone goes with each name. The lists vary, according to how each researcher interprets the ancient names. Paul E. Desautels, author of The Gem Kingdom, offers the following list, which uses modern gemstone names giving the tribe first and the stone associated with it.
(09:35:31) (Cris) This list follows the study by Bill yesterday.
(09:35:41) (Cris) Reuben: Carnelian
(09:36:12) (Cris) Simeon: Peridot
(09:36:27) (Cris) Levi: Emerald
(09:36:36) (Cris) Judah: Garnet
(09:36:45) (Cris) Issachar: Lapis lazuli
(09:36:54) (Cris) Zebulun: Rock crystal
(09:37:04) (Cris) Joseph: Zircon
(09:37:20) (Cris) Not cubic Zirconia that is a synthetic
(09:37:27) (Cris) But Zircon
(09:37:37) (Cris) Benjamin: Agate
(09:37:44) (Cris) Dan: Amethyst
(09:37:52) (Cris) Naphtali: Citrine
(09:38:05) (Cris) Gad: Onyx
(09:38:38) (Cris) Assher: Jasper
(09:39:12) (Cris) Some of the names are spelled slightly different because of the references I used
(09:40:36) (Cris) Some historians think that birthstones came from came from the Bible. Other people think that the birthstones are tied to the wisdom of ancient Atlantis, where history and myth tell us an advanced race of humans was able to do many things, including flight and astrology.
(09:41:05) (Cris) Finally, some believe that the birthstones were found by the original Druidic and pagan religions, where it was learned that all stones have a certain vibration that their chemical composition reacts to and that this vibration resonates with the natural vibrations of people born during each month.
(09:41:37) (Rosie) what do YOU believe, cris?
(09:42:01) (Cris) I think that if a stone resonates with you it is meant for you
(09:42:10) (anonymoo) isnt that last explanation closer to what Cayce eaches Cris?
(09:42:15) (Cris) Birthstones are a general category
(09:42:40) (yno) didnt bob dylan say everybody must get stoned?
(09:42:43) (Cris) yes but also remember there are more than one category of birthstones
(09:42:46) (mark) that what i was thinking,..that it all came from Atlantis
(09:42:53) (anonymoo) lol yno
(09:43:03) (yno) or lemuria ?
(09:43:09) (Cris) modern, traditional, mystical and astrological
(09:43:46) (Raleigh) cayce said each day is christmas cris / im guessing He was born all 365 days /
(09:44:11) (Alec) so much for staying on topic
(09:44:46) (Cris) Early civilizations in both India and Babylon as far back as 3000 BC invested rare and beautiful gemstones with magical properties. Quite often before a person talked to a Jeweler they consulted with some sort of astrologer first. The Indian and Babylonia system both linked the ruling planets with their corresponding gems. Giving rise to the zodiac type system that we use today.
(09:45:23) (Cris) The early gem buyers sought advice from astrologers first, in hopes that they could influence the forces that were identified with the planets in their favor. Because there was no formal classification of gemstones, a gem was assigned each sign of the zodiac based on a color system. Color was thought to unleash the power attributed to the stone.
(09:45:57) (anonymoo) cris u think its the stone that s magical ?
(09:46:34) (Cris) Only if it vibrates in tune with your body
(09:46:42) (anonymoo) yup
(09:46:43) (Cris) There are exceptions to every rule
(09:46:59) (Cris) The astrological concept of gems worked its way into Judo-Christian tradition through the 12-gem breastplate of Aaron as recorded in the Bible, in Exodus 28 and 39. Most scholars considered this to be the origins of our modern birthstone list.
(09:47:09) (anonymoo) vibrations or reactions to light in the body is what I think
(09:47:10) (Raleigh) the will of man overrides all
(09:47:27) (Cris) Theologians debated the importance of these gems, and what they really were. In the late 15th century scientist, begin to launch an attack on the idea that gems held any mystical importance. By the 1600's, zodiac gems were losing the race to birthstone gems.
(09:47:43) (Alec) would it be the actual stone? Or the life given to it by the Creative Forces (as Cayce would say) emanating through the stone?
(09:47:45) (Cris) The American National Association of Jewelers made the modern birthstone list public in 1912. The list was a source of some controversy; many of the gems were moved or dropped from the list completely.
(09:48:19) (anonymoo) sounds good Alec
(09:48:21) (Cris) I think the life given through the creator
(09:48:22) (Raleigh) even the prayers of 1 saves a nation cris
(09:48:25) (Alec) it was a question, anon
(09:48:31) (Cris) Try holding three or more stones of the same type
(09:49:01) (Cris) Often times only one of those will actually have the right feel for you
(09:49:19) (Cris) Just as our bodies are unique so are stones
(09:49:37) (anonymoo) maybe if we think in terms of how stones serve a purpose in machines it might clarify
(09:50:46) (Bill) i would say if an individual is not apply the knowledge they have any stone would have no more signifigance than any rock
(09:50:58) (Cris) Think back to the old crystal radios kids used to build
(09:51:17) (Alec) Bill, what if it is something like the placebo effect?
(09:51:20) (mark) and may it's from paet projections from others that had heald it
(09:51:21) (Cris) That is true Bill
(09:51:23) (Alec) how can thath be proven or disproven?
(09:51:41) (anonymoo) thinks about cell phones with gold in them
(09:52:04) (Cris) Stones are a focusing tool for God's purpose our energy at times
(09:52:08) (Raleigh) to not apply knowledge is a sin / to know to do good with that you know is a sin / to one givin much much is expeceted
(09:52:26) (Cris) The American National Association of Jewelers made the modern birthstone list public in 1912. The list was a source of some controversy; many of the gems were moved or dropped from the list completely.
(09:52:31) (Bill) if they were makeing effort Alec i'm sure there would be benifit because mind is the builder so what we think comes to pass
(09:52:47) (Cris) There have been attempts to standardize gemstones, but even now there is variation between stones and their months especially since astrological signs cross month borders. Astrology has different stones for the months, so birthstones are somewhat culturally specific.
(09:52:50) (Raleigh) better to not know than know and not do /; " ec
(09:53:12) (Alec) then is that saying that the stones themselves have no effect? Or do we, by the power of our thoughts magnify that effect?
(09:53:26) (Cris) The first list of birthstones I'm going to give is based on astrology
(09:53:28) (Alec) or do they just affect us, regardless?
(09:53:49) (Cris) Then I will go to the traditional listings
(09:54:08) (mark) a give and take on both sides
(09:54:09) (Cris) Stones vibrate just as we do Alec
(09:54:22) (Alec) hm
(09:54:26) (Cris) When used for a specific purpose they can assist us
(09:54:26) (WalksInSpirit) Stones speak. They have spirits. Even the Bible speaks of the stones crying out. All we have to do is stop, listen to them, and feel them.
(09:54:42) (anonymoo) I have never felt anything from a sone until I had an energy treatment wusing them
(09:55:06) (Alec) Not denying that WIS, but for arguments sake couldnt the stones crying out be a metaphor or exaggerated example?
(09:55:06) (Cris) It makes the conference I am going to more interesting for me
(09:55:12) (anonymoo) holy moo excuse the spe
(09:55:17) (Cris) I will pass on what I learn
(09:55:35) (Cris) No you can hear some stones sing Alec
(09:56:03) (WalksInSpirit) I don't think so, Alec. Based on personal experience and on what My People have believed for eons.
(09:56:10) (Alec) i see
(09:56:18) (Cris) Try being quiet in a quartz mining area in Arkansas you can often hear a ringing sound if you are quiet
(09:56:26) (Alec) really?
(09:56:29) (WalksInSpirit) Yep, Cris
(09:56:30) (anonymoo) I felt a spark from a stone
(09:56:39) (Alec) interesting
(09:57:08) (Cris) Aries March 21 to April 20 Birthstones:Diamond, Quartz
(09:57:36) (Cris) Taurus April 21 to May 20 Birthstones:Aventurine, Malachite, Emerald
(09:57:59) (Cris) Gemini May 21 to June 20 Birthstones:Agate, Tiger Eye, Fire Agate
(09:58:25) (Cris) Cancer June 21 to July 22 Birthstones:Moonstone, Pearl, Coral
(09:58:52) (Raleigh) alec i was proven beyond a shaddow the pwr of crystalz / i am 1 that needs proof
(09:58:54) (Cris) Leo July 23 to August 22 Birthstones:Ruby, Sardonyx, Carnelian
(09:58:54) (Cris) Leo July 23 to August 22 Birthstones:Ruby, Sardonyx, Carnelian
(09:59:15) (Alec) so am i, Ral
(09:59:25) (Cris) Virgo August 23 to September 22 Birthstones:Blue Saphire, Lapis Lazuli, Peridot
(09:59:31) (Raleigh) hello reflection / :)
(09:59:55) (Cris) Libra September 23 to October 22 Birthstones: Opal, Rose Quartz, Rhodochrosite
(09:59:55) (Alec) no that is just a smilarity taht you could find in over 2/3rds of the worlds population, Ral
(10:00:17) (Raleigh) k
(10:00:19) (Cris) Scorpio October 23 to November 21 Birthstones:Topaz, Jasper
(10:00:41) (Cris) Sagitarius November 22 to December 21 Birthstones:Turquoise, Lapis Lazuli
(10:00:47) (Raleigh) yeah i was big athiest till 33 years ago / enter cayce //
(10:01:07) (Cris) Capricorn December 22 to January 19 Birthstones:Garnet, Obsidian
(10:01:34) (Cris) Aquarius January 20 to February 18 Birthstones:Amethyst, Fire Opal
(10:02:00) (Cris) Pisces February 19 to March 20 Birthstones :Aquamarine, Bloodstone, Jade
(10:02:28) (anonymoo) those are a little different Cris
(10:03:04) (Cris) Yes they are and I have two more lists
(10:03:22) (Cris) If you don't like one birthstone you can choose another :o)
(10:03:32) (Raleigh) we are 2 signz off
(10:03:41) (Raleigh) " ec
(10:03:47) (Cris) It is interesting to see how they vary
(10:03:47) (mark) Cris,..which list feel's right to you?
(10:04:32) (Cris) I think it depends on the person remember we are all programmed different
(10:04:51) (mark) ok
(10:04:59) (Cris) I would go with the stone that felt right when I wore it
(10:05:15) (Raleigh) as i said cris / we as souls override all
(10:05:27) (Cris) January Birthstone: Garnet or Rose Quartz
(10:05:40) (Raleigh) stones simply assist
(10:05:40) (Cris) February Birthstone: Amethyst or Onyx
(10:05:48) (Cris) March Birthstone: Aquamarine or Bloodstone
(10:05:56) (Cris) April Birthstone: Diamond or Rock Crystal (Quartz)
(10:06:04) (Cris) May Birthstone: Emerald or Chrysoprase
(10:06:11) (Cris) June Birthstone: Alexandrite or Moonstone or Pearl
(10:06:20) (Cris) July Birthstone: Ruby or Carnelion
(10:06:25) (Raleigh) i am 17 march / but that is just to assist me
(10:06:27) (Cris) August Birthstone: Peridot or Sardonyx
(10:06:36) (Cris) September Birthstone: Sapphire or Lapis
(10:06:44) (Cris) October Birthstone: Opal or Tourmaline
(10:06:54) (Cris) November Birthstone: Topaz or Citrine
(10:07:03) (Cris) December Birthstone: Tanzanite, Zircon or Turquoise
(10:07:38) (Cris) Here is another list with modern, traditional and mystical
(10:07:43) (Raleigh) i am sorry cris / i just want to correct anything according to script and cayce this group
(10:08:05) (mark) oh i like the mystical
(10:08:22) (Cris) Let's go with the list right now and discuss it after
(10:08:28) (Cris) January- Modern: Garnet, Traditional: Garnet, Mystical: Emerald
(10:08:43) (Cris) February- Modern: Amethyst, Traditional: Amethyst, Mystical: Bloodstone
(10:08:47) (Raleigh) ill enterject when i see error only cris /
(10:08:55) (Cris) March- Modern: Aquamarine, Traditional: Bloodstone, Mystical: Jade
(10:09:05) (Cris) April- Modern: Diamond, Traditional: Diamond, Mystical: Opal
(10:09:15) (Cris) May- Modern: Emerald, Traditional: Emerald, Mystical: Sapphire
(10:09:24) (Cris) June- Modern: Pearl, Traditional: Alexandrite, Mystical: Moonstone
(10:09:34) (Cris) July- Modern: Ruby, Traditional: Ruby, Mystical: Ruby
(10:09:44) (Cris) August- Modern: Peridot, Traditional: Sardonyx, Mystical: Diamond
(10:09:57) (Cris) September- Modern: Sapphire, Traditional: Sapphire, Mystical: Agate
(10:10:05) (Cris) October- Modern: Opal, Traditional: Tourmaline, Mystical: Jasper
(10:10:13) (Cris) November- Modern: Topaz (Yellow), Traditional: Citrine, Mystical: Pearl
(10:10:21) (Cris) December- Modern: Turquoise, Traditional: Zircon, Mystical: Onyx
(10:10:32) (merri) well at least they all agree for July!
(10:10:53) (Cris) As you can see there are many choices except for July!
(10:10:55) (Raleigh) now ruby / the laser / ec said " rediscoverered " was the firestone of atltlantis i feel ///
(10:11:01) (Cris) Even that varies on other lists
(10:11:28) (merri) I'll take the ruby Cris!
(10:11:42) (Bill) Cancers are confuesed enough is my guess
(10:11:46) (Raleigh) i live on opal and rose hill now cris / cool huh?
(10:12:09) (Cris) very
(10:12:22) (Cris) You can mine them in NC
(10:12:41) (Raleigh) yeah / the sun though a ruby would solve the worlds energy needs huh?
(10:12:47) (Cris) I go to a creek in the National Forest
(10:12:52) (Raleigh) Laswerr
(10:13:02) (Raleigh) the laser
(10:13:19) (Raleigh) ill hush now / tx cris
(10:13:49) (Cris) George Frederick Kunz a well-known gem expert from the late 19th century and early 20th century is quoted often in the Edgar Cayce book, Gems and Stones. He was one of the sources in the book we just finished.
(10:14:06) (Cris) What is not known about him is that he wrote many books on mineralogy including metaphysical books such as, The Curious Lore of Precious Stones: Being a Description of Their Sentiments and Planetary Influences and Therapeutic Uses of Precious Stones;
(10:14:21) (Cris) Mystical Lore of Precious Stones. Another well-known book of the times was Astrology, Birthstones, Therapeutic and Religious. During this research I found over 15 metaphysical titles credited to him in part because he promoted jewelry for Tiffany’s.
(10:14:38) (Cris) In his book The Curious Lore of Precious Stones, Kunz says specific gemstones were associated with the twelve guardian angels and the twelve apostles. He gives the twelve apostles, angels and gemstones for each month. These came after Tiffany’s began to market birthstones for sale.
(10:15:11) (Cris) Don't forget the cash register ringing with some of these stone purchases
(10:15:26) (merri) LOL
(10:16:00) (Cris) A second reason for variety was the fact that people in each country chose birthstones that differed from those selected in other countries. As the idea of wearing birthstones became more popular, people began selecting less-expensive alternative gemstones, leading to more diversity.
(10:16:13) (mark) was he consistant in his listings?
(10:16:21) (Cris) In 1912, the National Association of Jewelers adopted the standardized list that is widely used today.
(10:16:53) (Cris) Not always he worked for Tiffany's he was known as a super salesman
(10:17:13) (Cris) He even made up rhymes to go with birthstones to push more sales
(10:17:23) (Raleigh) :)
(10:18:00) (Rosie) well, I guess we can see that the historical/traditional birthstones probably have no real bearing on our actual birth signs...so we should do like cris says and wear what feels right vibrationally
(10:18:02) (Cris) Again you are talking profit sharing and ringing registers
(10:18:37) (Raleigh) gee i wonder if 1 was to make a breastplate of stones as a jewesh priest //
(10:18:49) (Raleigh) send me 1 cris
(10:19:01) (Cris) If you like your birthstone buy one but try on several for feel first
(10:19:43) (Cris) Remember the most expensive isn't always the best sometimes it just has the highest markup
(10:20:12) (Cris) Not making or sending breastplates
(10:20:31) (Cris) Any questions on birthstones?
(10:20:43) (anonymoo) lol cris
(10:21:06) (Cris) I had to edit a LOT of material to make this manageable tonight
(10:21:11) (Rosie) this was very exhaustive and interesting cris...thanks!
(10:21:16) (Alec) appreciate it Cris, thank you : )
(10:21:17) (anonymoo) ty Cris
(10:21:21) (Blu) TY Cris, you did good
(10:21:27) (Cris) Thanks
(10:21:41) (merri) very interesting, thanks Cris
(10:21:44) (Bill) good job Cris
(10:21:48) (Cris) I liked the stones associated with the tribes
(10:21:55) (mark) thank you Cris
(10:22:04) (Cris) It went right along with the classes Bill and Roz gave
(10:22:40) (Cris) It showed how far back stones gained a history in being associated with a group
(10:22:41) (mark) yeah i think that's the list i'll go with
(10:23:55) (WalksInSpirit) Great presentation and great info tonight, Cris! Thank you!
(10:23:55) (Raleigh) i do have a querstion cris
(10:24:41) (Cris) Go ahead
(10:25:09) (Raleigh) so if we as souls say override all as the time of birth / birthstones say / why are we not "free of all things
(10:25:33) (Raleigh) created in his image as kids of god
(10:25:38) (Raleigh) ?
(10:26:00) (Cris) It is up to us to overcome those influences
(10:26:09) (Raleigh) i am fully recovered m/
(10:26:23) (Cris) It is now open chat
(10:26:26) (Raleigh) pls answer me cris
(10:26:45) (Bill) nothing over rides the will
(10:26:51) (Cris) I did in a physical body we are affect by our physical reality
(10:26:55) (Alec) unles we allow it to
(10:27:11) (mark) but i like Fire opal too
(10:27:24) (Alec) so then...yes that wouldnt be something overriding our will
(10:27:28) (Cris) Until we can overcome the physical mentally we feel those influences
(10:27:34) (Alec) it would be us ALLOWING, lol my mistake Bill sorry
(10:27:36) (Bill) and we constantly allow the ego to over ride :o)
(10:27:40) (Cris) physical body
(10:28:00) (Blu) it's an influence alec, does not override anything
(10:28:11) (Alec) then could you not say the same of ego?
(10:28:22) (Cris) I do belive in mind over matter
(10:28:46) (Cris) We have to tame our egos I know I'm still working on mine!
(10:28:48) (Rosie) thanks cris...and Peace {{{{{everyone}}}}}
(10:28:53) (mark) if you don't mind it does not matter
(10:29:07) (WalksInSpirit) LOL Mark
(10:30:03) (Blu) kind of like wearing blue because it brings out your eyes */ *
(10:30:22) (Alec) raises hand*
(10:30:24) (Cris) :o)
(10:30:32) (Bill) i've never put any effort into getting help from stones or anything else maybe i should give it a whirl this yr.
(10:30:37) (Alec) red does it too, Blu
(10:30:40) (Alec) the contrast
(10:30:56) (Alec) so i've been told *studio audience goes "woooooooo! and catcalls*
(10:30:59) (Blu) LOL, I don't vibrate well with red, if you can believe that!
(10:31:23) (Alec) hmm
(10:31:24) (Raleigh) so cris pls answeer
(10:31:32) (Alec) Ral, she answered you twice
(10:31:39) (Cris) I did twice already Raleigh
(10:31:40) (Raleigh) if i am free
(10:31:49) (Cris) unless I didn't get the question straight
(10:31:54) (WalksInSpirit) Raleigh, she has. Several times. So has others in here.
(10:32:18) (Raleigh) what would my time of birth mattewr if i override all influence
(10:32:21) (Raleigh) ?
(10:32:34) (Bill) it doesn't
(10:32:37) (Blu) So far I think of all the stone I vibrate best with lapis
(10:32:49) (Alec) ive no clue about my stones
(10:32:51) (Raleigh) stars / planets / birth time ///
(10:32:55) (Cris) I'm not an astrologer the person to ask that is someone dealing in it
(10:32:59) (WalksInSpirit) She told you if you don't feel a connection to your birthstone, then pick out a stone that you feel a connection to. It's that simple.
(10:33:18) (Raleigh) i am under NO influence yes>?
(10:33:24) (Alec) Ral...
(10:33:32) (Raleigh) yes cris?
(10:33:32) (Cris) Ral go to a gem and mineral show
(10:33:46) (Cris) They have a good one each year in Boise
(10:33:54) (merlin) anyone here ever hear of Ian xel Lungold and his website mayan majix
(10:33:55) (merri) influence no....tendencies yes, Ral
(10:34:02) (Cris) hold some of the stones in your hand and center yourself
(10:34:09) (Raleigh) ok alec / ill mello out / but what i say is true / True?
(10:34:21) (Cris) see which stones reasonate with you
(10:35:01) (Raleigh) ok cris / stones as the crystal ball can guide true //
(10:35:03) (Raleigh) yet
(10:35:11) (Cris) I'll look up the date for you in Lapidary Journal
(10:35:20) (Alec) Ral, focus buddy
(10:35:23) (Raleigh) its what we feel truth yes?
(10:35:26) (Alec) caaaaalm ; ) and focus
(10:35:27) (Raleigh) k
(10:35:29) (Alec) deep breaths
(10:35:31) (Raleigh) ok alec tx
(10:35:33) (merri) we are looking at stones as a tool here not to rule your life by Ral
(10:35:47) (Raleigh) i just get Hot when ----
(10:35:51) (Raleigh) hmmmmm
(10:36:13) (Raleigh) i dont like lies
(10:36:41) (Raleigh) cayce and script stated we are free / grace /
(10:36:52) (Raleigh) jesus grace
(10:37:05) (Blu) you are right Ral
(10:37:08) (Raleigh) i am free of All law
(10:37:26) (Alec) not Gods Law, Ral
(10:37:40) (Blu) not free of law, free of eternal conseqounces through grace
(10:37:45) (Raleigh) hi anne / do you feel i am the antichrist still anne?
(10:38:42) (Bill) TY Cris L&L Every One
(10:39:02) (Raleigh) alec / jesus grace freed us all / from all influence / starz / stones / plannets
(10:39:02) (Raleigh) alec / jesus grace freed us all / from all influence / starz / stones / plannets
(10:39:21) (Raleigh) b free alec
(10:39:27) (Raleigh) I Am
(10:40:00) (Alec) according to the doctrine and theology of salvation, Ral, Jesus sacrifice has saved us from our sins but that does not mean we cant be influenced by other forces or by life in general
(10:40:37) (Alec) Read about Padre Pios life, he was Catholic and was allaegedly attacked by satan night after night for a large part of his later years
(10:40:48) (Anne) that right
(10:41:37) (Alec) he was a Stigmatic Ral, and the devil still wrought havoc on him
(10:42:05) (Alec) there is never any of this happening while i am alive i swear......
(10:42:06) (Raleigh) hmmmm
(10:42:11) (Raleigh) nope
(10:42:19) (Alec) well, if there is i have not found out about it yet
(10:42:24) (Alec) to go see for myself
(10:42:30) (Raleigh) i follow the laws of go9d and man
(10:42:46) (Raleigh) im free /
(10:42:51) (Cris) Apparently that show isn't listed this year but the chamber of commerce will give you the show date
(10:43:11) (Cris) It is late here Blessings all
(09:26:28) (Cris) Lord and Protector of all please be with us on our spiritual journey as we seek a higher plane of thought. Let us see opportunity to work in your grace as we come together to seek peace in this world. Amen
(09:26:42) (Bill) Amen
(09:26:42) (Blu) Amen
(09:26:42) (WalksInSpirit) Nunwe
(09:26:50) (mark) Amen
(09:26:56) (Rosie) Awomen
(09:28:29) (Cris) Birthstones were and are used today as power stones by many people
(09:28:51) (Cris) Quite often the birthstone is one of the first purchased in jewelry
(09:30:00) (Cris) The first part of this will be some background through the ages
(09:30:49) (Cris) If you have questions feel free to interupt
(09:31:06) (Cris) Let all of us know if you have input
(09:31:10) (Cris) In the past some people originally chose gemstones to wear based on its color and the magical or healing powers associated with that color. The color green, for instance, was associated with spring. Spring and green symbolized faith and fertility. Emerald then became one of the green stones representing spring, a time of birth.
(09:31:31) (Cris) Because of the meanings attached to green, people began using emeralds to help lessen the pains of childbirth. (Gemstones for the other seasons are ruby for Summer, sapphire for Autumn, and diamond for Winter.)
(09:31:59) (Rosie) interesting!
(09:34:01) (Cris) Gemstone folklore later came from legends and mythology. An example of this was the perception that amethyst prevented drunkenness. That belief started with a Greek myth about the wine god, Bacchus. Amethyst was a beautiful and innocent young woman condemned to die by Bacchus. The goddess Diana turned Amethyst into a white crystal to protect her from Bacchus. Bacchus poured wine on the crystal, staining it purple.
(09:34:44) (Cris) This next bit will go along with last night's class from Bill
(09:34:59) (Cris) About 1300 B.C. some gemstones acquired religious significance. In Exodus 28:17-21, specific gemstones were associated with each of the twelve tribes of Israel. People of Jewish heritage may choose their birthstones based on their tribal names.
(09:35:20) (Cris) Historians have complied several lists of which stone goes with each name. The lists vary, according to how each researcher interprets the ancient names. Paul E. Desautels, author of The Gem Kingdom, offers the following list, which uses modern gemstone names giving the tribe first and the stone associated with it.
(09:35:31) (Cris) This list follows the study by Bill yesterday.
(09:35:41) (Cris) Reuben: Carnelian
(09:36:12) (Cris) Simeon: Peridot
(09:36:27) (Cris) Levi: Emerald
(09:36:36) (Cris) Judah: Garnet
(09:36:45) (Cris) Issachar: Lapis lazuli
(09:36:54) (Cris) Zebulun: Rock crystal
(09:37:04) (Cris) Joseph: Zircon
(09:37:20) (Cris) Not cubic Zirconia that is a synthetic
(09:37:27) (Cris) But Zircon
(09:37:37) (Cris) Benjamin: Agate
(09:37:44) (Cris) Dan: Amethyst
(09:37:52) (Cris) Naphtali: Citrine
(09:38:05) (Cris) Gad: Onyx
(09:38:38) (Cris) Assher: Jasper
(09:39:12) (Cris) Some of the names are spelled slightly different because of the references I used
(09:40:36) (Cris) Some historians think that birthstones came from came from the Bible. Other people think that the birthstones are tied to the wisdom of ancient Atlantis, where history and myth tell us an advanced race of humans was able to do many things, including flight and astrology.
(09:41:05) (Cris) Finally, some believe that the birthstones were found by the original Druidic and pagan religions, where it was learned that all stones have a certain vibration that their chemical composition reacts to and that this vibration resonates with the natural vibrations of people born during each month.
(09:41:37) (Rosie) what do YOU believe, cris?
(09:42:01) (Cris) I think that if a stone resonates with you it is meant for you
(09:42:10) (anonymoo) isnt that last explanation closer to what Cayce eaches Cris?
(09:42:15) (Cris) Birthstones are a general category
(09:42:40) (yno) didnt bob dylan say everybody must get stoned?
(09:42:43) (Cris) yes but also remember there are more than one category of birthstones
(09:42:46) (mark) that what i was thinking,..that it all came from Atlantis
(09:42:53) (anonymoo) lol yno
(09:43:03) (yno) or lemuria ?
(09:43:09) (Cris) modern, traditional, mystical and astrological
(09:43:46) (Raleigh) cayce said each day is christmas cris / im guessing He was born all 365 days /
(09:44:11) (Alec) so much for staying on topic
(09:44:46) (Cris) Early civilizations in both India and Babylon as far back as 3000 BC invested rare and beautiful gemstones with magical properties. Quite often before a person talked to a Jeweler they consulted with some sort of astrologer first. The Indian and Babylonia system both linked the ruling planets with their corresponding gems. Giving rise to the zodiac type system that we use today.
(09:45:23) (Cris) The early gem buyers sought advice from astrologers first, in hopes that they could influence the forces that were identified with the planets in their favor. Because there was no formal classification of gemstones, a gem was assigned each sign of the zodiac based on a color system. Color was thought to unleash the power attributed to the stone.
(09:45:57) (anonymoo) cris u think its the stone that s magical ?
(09:46:34) (Cris) Only if it vibrates in tune with your body
(09:46:42) (anonymoo) yup
(09:46:43) (Cris) There are exceptions to every rule
(09:46:59) (Cris) The astrological concept of gems worked its way into Judo-Christian tradition through the 12-gem breastplate of Aaron as recorded in the Bible, in Exodus 28 and 39. Most scholars considered this to be the origins of our modern birthstone list.
(09:47:09) (anonymoo) vibrations or reactions to light in the body is what I think
(09:47:10) (Raleigh) the will of man overrides all
(09:47:27) (Cris) Theologians debated the importance of these gems, and what they really were. In the late 15th century scientist, begin to launch an attack on the idea that gems held any mystical importance. By the 1600's, zodiac gems were losing the race to birthstone gems.
(09:47:43) (Alec) would it be the actual stone? Or the life given to it by the Creative Forces (as Cayce would say) emanating through the stone?
(09:47:45) (Cris) The American National Association of Jewelers made the modern birthstone list public in 1912. The list was a source of some controversy; many of the gems were moved or dropped from the list completely.
(09:48:19) (anonymoo) sounds good Alec
(09:48:21) (Cris) I think the life given through the creator
(09:48:22) (Raleigh) even the prayers of 1 saves a nation cris
(09:48:25) (Alec) it was a question, anon
(09:48:31) (Cris) Try holding three or more stones of the same type
(09:49:01) (Cris) Often times only one of those will actually have the right feel for you
(09:49:19) (Cris) Just as our bodies are unique so are stones
(09:49:37) (anonymoo) maybe if we think in terms of how stones serve a purpose in machines it might clarify
(09:50:46) (Bill) i would say if an individual is not apply the knowledge they have any stone would have no more signifigance than any rock
(09:50:58) (Cris) Think back to the old crystal radios kids used to build
(09:51:17) (Alec) Bill, what if it is something like the placebo effect?
(09:51:20) (mark) and may it's from paet projections from others that had heald it
(09:51:21) (Cris) That is true Bill
(09:51:23) (Alec) how can thath be proven or disproven?
(09:51:41) (anonymoo) thinks about cell phones with gold in them
(09:52:04) (Cris) Stones are a focusing tool for God's purpose our energy at times
(09:52:08) (Raleigh) to not apply knowledge is a sin / to know to do good with that you know is a sin / to one givin much much is expeceted
(09:52:26) (Cris) The American National Association of Jewelers made the modern birthstone list public in 1912. The list was a source of some controversy; many of the gems were moved or dropped from the list completely.
(09:52:31) (Bill) if they were makeing effort Alec i'm sure there would be benifit because mind is the builder so what we think comes to pass
(09:52:47) (Cris) There have been attempts to standardize gemstones, but even now there is variation between stones and their months especially since astrological signs cross month borders. Astrology has different stones for the months, so birthstones are somewhat culturally specific.
(09:52:50) (Raleigh) better to not know than know and not do /; " ec
(09:53:12) (Alec) then is that saying that the stones themselves have no effect? Or do we, by the power of our thoughts magnify that effect?
(09:53:26) (Cris) The first list of birthstones I'm going to give is based on astrology
(09:53:28) (Alec) or do they just affect us, regardless?
(09:53:49) (Cris) Then I will go to the traditional listings
(09:54:08) (mark) a give and take on both sides
(09:54:09) (Cris) Stones vibrate just as we do Alec
(09:54:22) (Alec) hm
(09:54:26) (Cris) When used for a specific purpose they can assist us
(09:54:26) (WalksInSpirit) Stones speak. They have spirits. Even the Bible speaks of the stones crying out. All we have to do is stop, listen to them, and feel them.
(09:54:42) (anonymoo) I have never felt anything from a sone until I had an energy treatment wusing them
(09:55:06) (Alec) Not denying that WIS, but for arguments sake couldnt the stones crying out be a metaphor or exaggerated example?
(09:55:06) (Cris) It makes the conference I am going to more interesting for me
(09:55:12) (anonymoo) holy moo excuse the spe
(09:55:17) (Cris) I will pass on what I learn
(09:55:35) (Cris) No you can hear some stones sing Alec
(09:56:03) (WalksInSpirit) I don't think so, Alec. Based on personal experience and on what My People have believed for eons.
(09:56:10) (Alec) i see
(09:56:18) (Cris) Try being quiet in a quartz mining area in Arkansas you can often hear a ringing sound if you are quiet
(09:56:26) (Alec) really?
(09:56:29) (WalksInSpirit) Yep, Cris
(09:56:30) (anonymoo) I felt a spark from a stone
(09:56:39) (Alec) interesting
(09:57:08) (Cris) Aries March 21 to April 20 Birthstones:Diamond, Quartz
(09:57:36) (Cris) Taurus April 21 to May 20 Birthstones:Aventurine, Malachite, Emerald
(09:57:59) (Cris) Gemini May 21 to June 20 Birthstones:Agate, Tiger Eye, Fire Agate
(09:58:25) (Cris) Cancer June 21 to July 22 Birthstones:Moonstone, Pearl, Coral
(09:58:52) (Raleigh) alec i was proven beyond a shaddow the pwr of crystalz / i am 1 that needs proof
(09:58:54) (Cris) Leo July 23 to August 22 Birthstones:Ruby, Sardonyx, Carnelian
(09:58:54) (Cris) Leo July 23 to August 22 Birthstones:Ruby, Sardonyx, Carnelian
(09:59:15) (Alec) so am i, Ral
(09:59:25) (Cris) Virgo August 23 to September 22 Birthstones:Blue Saphire, Lapis Lazuli, Peridot
(09:59:31) (Raleigh) hello reflection / :)
(09:59:55) (Cris) Libra September 23 to October 22 Birthstones: Opal, Rose Quartz, Rhodochrosite
(09:59:55) (Alec) no that is just a smilarity taht you could find in over 2/3rds of the worlds population, Ral
(10:00:17) (Raleigh) k
(10:00:19) (Cris) Scorpio October 23 to November 21 Birthstones:Topaz, Jasper
(10:00:41) (Cris) Sagitarius November 22 to December 21 Birthstones:Turquoise, Lapis Lazuli
(10:00:47) (Raleigh) yeah i was big athiest till 33 years ago / enter cayce //
(10:01:07) (Cris) Capricorn December 22 to January 19 Birthstones:Garnet, Obsidian
(10:01:34) (Cris) Aquarius January 20 to February 18 Birthstones:Amethyst, Fire Opal
(10:02:00) (Cris) Pisces February 19 to March 20 Birthstones :Aquamarine, Bloodstone, Jade
(10:02:28) (anonymoo) those are a little different Cris
(10:03:04) (Cris) Yes they are and I have two more lists
(10:03:22) (Cris) If you don't like one birthstone you can choose another :o)
(10:03:32) (Raleigh) we are 2 signz off
(10:03:41) (Raleigh) " ec
(10:03:47) (Cris) It is interesting to see how they vary
(10:03:47) (mark) Cris,..which list feel's right to you?
(10:04:32) (Cris) I think it depends on the person remember we are all programmed different
(10:04:51) (mark) ok
(10:04:59) (Cris) I would go with the stone that felt right when I wore it
(10:05:15) (Raleigh) as i said cris / we as souls override all
(10:05:27) (Cris) January Birthstone: Garnet or Rose Quartz
(10:05:40) (Raleigh) stones simply assist
(10:05:40) (Cris) February Birthstone: Amethyst or Onyx
(10:05:48) (Cris) March Birthstone: Aquamarine or Bloodstone
(10:05:56) (Cris) April Birthstone: Diamond or Rock Crystal (Quartz)
(10:06:04) (Cris) May Birthstone: Emerald or Chrysoprase
(10:06:11) (Cris) June Birthstone: Alexandrite or Moonstone or Pearl
(10:06:20) (Cris) July Birthstone: Ruby or Carnelion
(10:06:25) (Raleigh) i am 17 march / but that is just to assist me
(10:06:27) (Cris) August Birthstone: Peridot or Sardonyx
(10:06:36) (Cris) September Birthstone: Sapphire or Lapis
(10:06:44) (Cris) October Birthstone: Opal or Tourmaline
(10:06:54) (Cris) November Birthstone: Topaz or Citrine
(10:07:03) (Cris) December Birthstone: Tanzanite, Zircon or Turquoise
(10:07:38) (Cris) Here is another list with modern, traditional and mystical
(10:07:43) (Raleigh) i am sorry cris / i just want to correct anything according to script and cayce this group
(10:08:05) (mark) oh i like the mystical
(10:08:22) (Cris) Let's go with the list right now and discuss it after
(10:08:28) (Cris) January- Modern: Garnet, Traditional: Garnet, Mystical: Emerald
(10:08:43) (Cris) February- Modern: Amethyst, Traditional: Amethyst, Mystical: Bloodstone
(10:08:47) (Raleigh) ill enterject when i see error only cris /
(10:08:55) (Cris) March- Modern: Aquamarine, Traditional: Bloodstone, Mystical: Jade
(10:09:05) (Cris) April- Modern: Diamond, Traditional: Diamond, Mystical: Opal
(10:09:15) (Cris) May- Modern: Emerald, Traditional: Emerald, Mystical: Sapphire
(10:09:24) (Cris) June- Modern: Pearl, Traditional: Alexandrite, Mystical: Moonstone
(10:09:34) (Cris) July- Modern: Ruby, Traditional: Ruby, Mystical: Ruby
(10:09:44) (Cris) August- Modern: Peridot, Traditional: Sardonyx, Mystical: Diamond
(10:09:57) (Cris) September- Modern: Sapphire, Traditional: Sapphire, Mystical: Agate
(10:10:05) (Cris) October- Modern: Opal, Traditional: Tourmaline, Mystical: Jasper
(10:10:13) (Cris) November- Modern: Topaz (Yellow), Traditional: Citrine, Mystical: Pearl
(10:10:21) (Cris) December- Modern: Turquoise, Traditional: Zircon, Mystical: Onyx
(10:10:32) (merri) well at least they all agree for July!
(10:10:53) (Cris) As you can see there are many choices except for July!
(10:10:55) (Raleigh) now ruby / the laser / ec said " rediscoverered " was the firestone of atltlantis i feel ///
(10:11:01) (Cris) Even that varies on other lists
(10:11:28) (merri) I'll take the ruby Cris!
(10:11:42) (Bill) Cancers are confuesed enough is my guess
(10:11:46) (Raleigh) i live on opal and rose hill now cris / cool huh?
(10:12:09) (Cris) very
(10:12:22) (Cris) You can mine them in NC
(10:12:41) (Raleigh) yeah / the sun though a ruby would solve the worlds energy needs huh?
(10:12:47) (Cris) I go to a creek in the National Forest
(10:12:52) (Raleigh) Laswerr
(10:13:02) (Raleigh) the laser
(10:13:19) (Raleigh) ill hush now / tx cris
(10:13:49) (Cris) George Frederick Kunz a well-known gem expert from the late 19th century and early 20th century is quoted often in the Edgar Cayce book, Gems and Stones. He was one of the sources in the book we just finished.
(10:14:06) (Cris) What is not known about him is that he wrote many books on mineralogy including metaphysical books such as, The Curious Lore of Precious Stones: Being a Description of Their Sentiments and Planetary Influences and Therapeutic Uses of Precious Stones;
(10:14:21) (Cris) Mystical Lore of Precious Stones. Another well-known book of the times was Astrology, Birthstones, Therapeutic and Religious. During this research I found over 15 metaphysical titles credited to him in part because he promoted jewelry for Tiffany’s.
(10:14:38) (Cris) In his book The Curious Lore of Precious Stones, Kunz says specific gemstones were associated with the twelve guardian angels and the twelve apostles. He gives the twelve apostles, angels and gemstones for each month. These came after Tiffany’s began to market birthstones for sale.
(10:15:11) (Cris) Don't forget the cash register ringing with some of these stone purchases
(10:15:26) (merri) LOL
(10:16:00) (Cris) A second reason for variety was the fact that people in each country chose birthstones that differed from those selected in other countries. As the idea of wearing birthstones became more popular, people began selecting less-expensive alternative gemstones, leading to more diversity.
(10:16:13) (mark) was he consistant in his listings?
(10:16:21) (Cris) In 1912, the National Association of Jewelers adopted the standardized list that is widely used today.
(10:16:53) (Cris) Not always he worked for Tiffany's he was known as a super salesman
(10:17:13) (Cris) He even made up rhymes to go with birthstones to push more sales
(10:17:23) (Raleigh) :)
(10:18:00) (Rosie) well, I guess we can see that the historical/traditional birthstones probably have no real bearing on our actual birth signs...so we should do like cris says and wear what feels right vibrationally
(10:18:02) (Cris) Again you are talking profit sharing and ringing registers
(10:18:37) (Raleigh) gee i wonder if 1 was to make a breastplate of stones as a jewesh priest //
(10:18:49) (Raleigh) send me 1 cris
(10:19:01) (Cris) If you like your birthstone buy one but try on several for feel first
(10:19:43) (Cris) Remember the most expensive isn't always the best sometimes it just has the highest markup
(10:20:12) (Cris) Not making or sending breastplates
(10:20:31) (Cris) Any questions on birthstones?
(10:20:43) (anonymoo) lol cris
(10:21:06) (Cris) I had to edit a LOT of material to make this manageable tonight
(10:21:11) (Rosie) this was very exhaustive and interesting cris...thanks!
(10:21:16) (Alec) appreciate it Cris, thank you : )
(10:21:17) (anonymoo) ty Cris
(10:21:21) (Blu) TY Cris, you did good
(10:21:27) (Cris) Thanks
(10:21:41) (merri) very interesting, thanks Cris
(10:21:44) (Bill) good job Cris
(10:21:48) (Cris) I liked the stones associated with the tribes
(10:21:55) (mark) thank you Cris
(10:22:04) (Cris) It went right along with the classes Bill and Roz gave
(10:22:40) (Cris) It showed how far back stones gained a history in being associated with a group
(10:22:41) (mark) yeah i think that's the list i'll go with
(10:23:55) (WalksInSpirit) Great presentation and great info tonight, Cris! Thank you!
(10:23:55) (Raleigh) i do have a querstion cris
(10:24:41) (Cris) Go ahead
(10:25:09) (Raleigh) so if we as souls say override all as the time of birth / birthstones say / why are we not "free of all things
(10:25:33) (Raleigh) created in his image as kids of god
(10:25:38) (Raleigh) ?
(10:26:00) (Cris) It is up to us to overcome those influences
(10:26:09) (Raleigh) i am fully recovered m/
(10:26:23) (Cris) It is now open chat
(10:26:26) (Raleigh) pls answer me cris
(10:26:45) (Bill) nothing over rides the will
(10:26:51) (Cris) I did in a physical body we are affect by our physical reality
(10:26:55) (Alec) unles we allow it to
(10:27:11) (mark) but i like Fire opal too
(10:27:24) (Alec) so then...yes that wouldnt be something overriding our will
(10:27:28) (Cris) Until we can overcome the physical mentally we feel those influences
(10:27:34) (Alec) it would be us ALLOWING, lol my mistake Bill sorry
(10:27:36) (Bill) and we constantly allow the ego to over ride :o)
(10:27:40) (Cris) physical body
(10:28:00) (Blu) it's an influence alec, does not override anything
(10:28:11) (Alec) then could you not say the same of ego?
(10:28:22) (Cris) I do belive in mind over matter
(10:28:46) (Cris) We have to tame our egos I know I'm still working on mine!
(10:28:48) (Rosie) thanks cris...and Peace {{{{{everyone}}}}}
(10:28:53) (mark) if you don't mind it does not matter
(10:29:07) (WalksInSpirit) LOL Mark
(10:30:03) (Blu) kind of like wearing blue because it brings out your eyes */ *
(10:30:22) (Alec) raises hand*
(10:30:24) (Cris) :o)
(10:30:32) (Bill) i've never put any effort into getting help from stones or anything else maybe i should give it a whirl this yr.
(10:30:37) (Alec) red does it too, Blu
(10:30:40) (Alec) the contrast
(10:30:56) (Alec) so i've been told *studio audience goes "woooooooo! and catcalls*
(10:30:59) (Blu) LOL, I don't vibrate well with red, if you can believe that!
(10:31:23) (Alec) hmm
(10:31:24) (Raleigh) so cris pls answeer
(10:31:32) (Alec) Ral, she answered you twice
(10:31:39) (Cris) I did twice already Raleigh
(10:31:40) (Raleigh) if i am free
(10:31:49) (Cris) unless I didn't get the question straight
(10:31:54) (WalksInSpirit) Raleigh, she has. Several times. So has others in here.
(10:32:18) (Raleigh) what would my time of birth mattewr if i override all influence
(10:32:21) (Raleigh) ?
(10:32:34) (Bill) it doesn't
(10:32:37) (Blu) So far I think of all the stone I vibrate best with lapis
(10:32:49) (Alec) ive no clue about my stones
(10:32:51) (Raleigh) stars / planets / birth time ///
(10:32:55) (Cris) I'm not an astrologer the person to ask that is someone dealing in it
(10:32:59) (WalksInSpirit) She told you if you don't feel a connection to your birthstone, then pick out a stone that you feel a connection to. It's that simple.
(10:33:18) (Raleigh) i am under NO influence yes>?
(10:33:24) (Alec) Ral...
(10:33:32) (Raleigh) yes cris?
(10:33:32) (Cris) Ral go to a gem and mineral show
(10:33:46) (Cris) They have a good one each year in Boise
(10:33:54) (merlin) anyone here ever hear of Ian xel Lungold and his website mayan majix
(10:33:55) (merri) influence no....tendencies yes, Ral
(10:34:02) (Cris) hold some of the stones in your hand and center yourself
(10:34:09) (Raleigh) ok alec / ill mello out / but what i say is true / True?
(10:34:21) (Cris) see which stones reasonate with you
(10:35:01) (Raleigh) ok cris / stones as the crystal ball can guide true //
(10:35:03) (Raleigh) yet
(10:35:11) (Cris) I'll look up the date for you in Lapidary Journal
(10:35:20) (Alec) Ral, focus buddy
(10:35:23) (Raleigh) its what we feel truth yes?
(10:35:26) (Alec) caaaaalm ; ) and focus
(10:35:27) (Raleigh) k
(10:35:29) (Alec) deep breaths
(10:35:31) (Raleigh) ok alec tx
(10:35:33) (merri) we are looking at stones as a tool here not to rule your life by Ral
(10:35:47) (Raleigh) i just get Hot when ----
(10:35:51) (Raleigh) hmmmmm
(10:36:13) (Raleigh) i dont like lies
(10:36:41) (Raleigh) cayce and script stated we are free / grace /
(10:36:52) (Raleigh) jesus grace
(10:37:05) (Blu) you are right Ral
(10:37:08) (Raleigh) i am free of All law
(10:37:26) (Alec) not Gods Law, Ral
(10:37:40) (Blu) not free of law, free of eternal conseqounces through grace
(10:37:45) (Raleigh) hi anne / do you feel i am the antichrist still anne?
(10:38:42) (Bill) TY Cris L&L Every One
(10:39:02) (Raleigh) alec / jesus grace freed us all / from all influence / starz / stones / plannets
(10:39:02) (Raleigh) alec / jesus grace freed us all / from all influence / starz / stones / plannets
(10:39:21) (Raleigh) b free alec
(10:39:27) (Raleigh) I Am
(10:40:00) (Alec) according to the doctrine and theology of salvation, Ral, Jesus sacrifice has saved us from our sins but that does not mean we cant be influenced by other forces or by life in general
(10:40:37) (Alec) Read about Padre Pios life, he was Catholic and was allaegedly attacked by satan night after night for a large part of his later years
(10:40:48) (Anne) that right
(10:41:37) (Alec) he was a Stigmatic Ral, and the devil still wrought havoc on him
(10:42:05) (Alec) there is never any of this happening while i am alive i swear......
(10:42:06) (Raleigh) hmmmm
(10:42:11) (Raleigh) nope
(10:42:19) (Alec) well, if there is i have not found out about it yet
(10:42:24) (Alec) to go see for myself
(10:42:30) (Raleigh) i follow the laws of go9d and man
(10:42:46) (Raleigh) im free /
(10:42:51) (Cris) Apparently that show isn't listed this year but the chamber of commerce will give you the show date
(10:43:11) (Cris) It is late here Blessings all