Post by WalksInSpirit on Jun 19, 2006 15:22:23 GMT -5
Astrology Chat: 06-19-06
(02:31:13) (ron) JANUARY 2002 / ANCIENT MYSTERIES
(02:32:01) (ron) "We three Kings of Orient are, bearing gifts we travel afar...," and so go the lyrics to the popular Christmas carol with which we are so familiar. It was written of course to commemorate the arrival of the Magi, or Wise Men, at the birth of the Christ Child. However, according to the Cayce readings, these visitors were not really kings and there were more than three of them,
(02:32:39) (ron) arriving in several different groups from at least five different countries. In addition, although the modern Church celebrates their visitation on January 6, Cayce tells us that they were not actually presented to the Child until after the time of Mary's purification in accordance with Jewish Law (29 to 40 days after birth). (5749-7)
(02:33:26) (ron) Cayce's expanded story comes together over multiple readings, including two in which individuals were told that they had been the Wise Men of the Nativity story in previous lives.
(02:33:47) (ron) In Cayce's narrative, the true purpose and meaning of the gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh is explained, and we are even told why one group was routed through Herod rather than directly to the Christ Child. The readings also point out that the Wise Men's visit served to provide encouragement and support to Mary and those around her.
(02:34:20) (ron) WHAT THE BIBLE TELLS US
(02:34:43) (ron) Despite the additional detail, amazingly, the Cayce readings do not contradict the story we are told in the New Testament. One reason for this is that the Magi are mentioned briefly in only one of the books of the New Testament (Matthew 2: 1-16).
(02:35:11) (ron) Not only that, the actual number of Wise Men is not noted. Bible scholars speculate that the tradition of the number three was taken from the number of gifts given (gold, frankincense, and myrrh). The Cayce readings indicate that there may have been as many as five different groups arriving before, during, and after the birth (although none were presented until the proper time).
(02:35:52) (ron) We are told in the Scriptures that the Magi had received a revelation of sorts and were following a star that they believed would lead them to the newly born "King of the Jews." For some reason they stopped in Jerusalem to inquire of the Child's whereabouts. Herod, the current head of the Jewish government under the Romans, felt immediately threatened and conspired with his chief scribes to use the Magi to locate this potential rival. The Magi, however, were direc
(02:36:27) (ron) dream not to return to Herod with the information. As a result, Herod ordered the death of all children in the area under the age of two years. Joseph, warned in a dream to flee with the Child to Egypt, escaped with the family.
(02:36:56) (ron) WERE THE WISE MEN SPIRITUAL ADEPTS?
(02:37:27) (ron) Although Bible scholars believe that the Wise Men came from Persia, Matthew's gospel does not specify the country of origin, just that they came from the East. Cayce states specifically that "They came from Persia, India, Egypt, and also from Chaldea, Gobi (China), and what is NOW the Indo or Tao land." (2067-7)
(02:37:58) (ron) Asimov's Guide to the New Testament states that the Persian priests of the ancient Zoroastrian religion were called "magu," which in Latin becomes "magi." This is particularly interesting, since the Cayce readings indicate that a previous incarnation of the Christ soul was Zend, the father of Zoroaster.
(02:38:31) (ron) The Jewish Encyclopedia tells us that the term magi was given to magicians from the Babylonian and Egyptian religions. The practice of magic was common throughout ancient Israel and the Middle East, especially among scholars. So-called white magic was differentiated from black
(02:39:01) (ron) magic (sorcery and worship of false gods) and was used primarily to counteract the latter form or for healing. "It was, however, only the practice of witchcraft that was prohibited, for a knowledge of magic was indispensable to a member of the chief councilor of the judiciary..."
(02:39:39) (ron) It appears that white magic may have been a blanket term given to practices we would today list under psychic ability. In the Talmud, for example, Jesus is regarded as a magician. It is also noted that portions of these traditions, although condemned by some Hebrew factions, are said to be contained in the Kabala teachings.
(02:40:16) (ron) In the life readings for the former Wise Men, Cayce describes them as being both very spiritual and very intelligent and as having skills in astrology, astronomy, and mathematics. (256-1; 1908-1) They were spiritual seekers who were very much aware of the Hebrew Messianic prophecies.
(02:40:47) (ron) skills in astrology, astronomy, and mathematics. (256-1; 1908-1)
(02:41:04) (ron) In one reading, Cayce refers to the Wise Men as "...those that subdued - not that were ruled by, but subdued the understandings of that in the earth - were considered, or were in the position of the wise, or the sages, or the ones that were holy; in body and mind, in accord with purposes." He further indicates that they found their way to the Christ Child "...in and through the application of those forces - as ye would term today psychic" (5749-7)
(02:41:34) (ron) to subdue the earth?...with what?...one's will?
(02:41:55) (Lynn) the understanding to work in harmony with
(02:42:09) (ron) ESSENE RECORDS HIDDEN IN PYRAMID
(02:42:41) (ron) Cayce also tells us that the Wise Men had spent time studying records of ancient wisdom kept in Egypt. It was from these records that they knew about the coming of the Messiah and the preparations made by a Jewish sect known as the Essenes. (1010-17
(02:43:10) (ron) An Essene teacher by the name of Judy was in charge of the records. She sent the first group of Wise Men to Herod in an attempt to undermine his relationship with the Romans and thus topple him from his throne. Her plan backfired and ultimately caused the death of many innocent children. As a result, she was told that, in this lifetime, she had to learn not to sit in judgment of others, regardless of their sins. (1472-3)
(02:43:57) (ron) my comment on "to subdue the earth" was that i was referring to the Bible, i believe is in the 2nd chapter of Genesis
(02:44:16) (Lynn) ok, mine the same
(02:44:22) (ron) could be the 1st chapter..forgot which
(02:44:36) (Lynn) I know
(02:45:08) (ron) Both Judy and another Essene teacher, Josie, were responsible for assisting in Jesus' education during his studies in Egypt, Persia and India. In fact, a reading given in July of 1932 asserts that records of this training were located in a pyramid "yet to be uncovered," and that the records might come to light between 1936 and 1940, "When there has been sufficient of the reckoning through which the world is passing in the present..." (5749-2)
(02:45:54) (ron) The readings also seem to indicate that these records contain the information studied by the Wise Men. Some have speculated that the 13 papyrus books found in Nag Hammadi, Egypt, in 1945 and/or the Dead Sea Scrolls, discovered shortly thereafter, could be the information to which Cayce was referring.
(02:46:22) (ron) Cayce also indicated that Herod's wife, who had contact with both the Essenes and the Wise Men, had written a history of this time period, which was lost with the destruction of the Alexandria library. (2067-1) In his recent book, An American Prophet, Sidney Kirkpatrick states that portions of this narrative may still exist in the Vatican Library.
(02:46:57) (ron) may still exist in the Vatican Library.
(02:47:12) (ron) THE MEANING OF THE GIFTS
(02:47:44) (ron) In one reading, regarding the training of the Christ Child by the Essenes, Cayce was asked, "What relation was there in the training with the three wise men?"
(02:48:12) (ron) His answer was that the presentation of the gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh by the Magi was a highly significant ritual, which prefigured the future development of Jesus and his initiation into his ministry later in life.
(02:48:36) (ron) "So they represent in the metaphysical sense the three phases of man's experience in materiality; gold, the material; frankincense, the ether or ethereal; myrrh, the healing force as brought with same; or body, mind, soul." (5749-7)
(02:49:17) (ron) Charles Filmore notes in the Metaphysical Dictionary that the Wise Men are archetypal symbols which represent "the wisdom that is carried within the soul from previous incarnations. They are the inner realms of consciousness that, like books of life, have kept the records of past lives and held them in reserve for the great day when the soul would receive the supreme ego, Jesus."
(02:49:56) (ron) ego...i like my ego
(02:50:11) (ron) In other words, they represent our higher self and our inner essence or individuality, as Cayce termed it. This inner wisdom serves to encourage and support our preparation for the birth of the Christ Consciousness into our limited consciousness.
(02:50:38) (Lynn) that is meaningful, ron
(02:50:43) (ron) WHAT HAPPENED TO THE WISE MEN?
(02:51:15) (ron) The Cayce CDROM contains a magazine excerpt from 1967 recounting the Church tradition that the Wise Men were baptized by St. Thomas in India 40 years after Bethlehem. They were subsequently ordained as Christian priests and eventually martyred for their faith. Their bodies were supposedly buried in the mosque of St. Sophia at Constantinople, later moved to a Cathedral in Milan, Italy, and then to Cologne, Germany.
(02:51:51) (ron) The Dictionary of Saints by John Delaney notes a first century tradition identifying the three Magi as Balthasar, Caspar, and Melchior. They were believed to be astrologers from Babylonia and Arabia and have been deemed the patron saints of travelers.
(02:52:13) (ron) believed to be astrologers
(02:52:47) (Lynn) some versions still translate wisemen as astrologers, ron
(02:52:56) (ron) END...i hope all of you found this article to be very informative...such things are always a learning thing for me
(02:53:09) (Lynn) very meaningful to me
(02:53:24) (ron) take a break...i have another article...if you wish
(02:53:48) (diane) great material ron. Sounds familiar to me
(02:54:08) (Lynn) I love what was said about subdue the earth. Subduing is not conquering. To subdue is to understand and work in harmony with.
(02:54:22) (ron) thank you lynn...appreciate your thoughts
(02:54:22) (Lynn) Then there is love given and received.
(02:55:10) (Lynn) You must do a good deal of work to find just the correct writings for your classes. They always have rich surface and rich deep meanings, ron.
(02:55:13) (diane) that makes sense
(02:55:21) (diane) Agree Lynn!
(02:55:24) (Lynn) for me
(02:55:25) (ron) thanks
(02:56:07) (Lynn) I would like to say that there is no such thing as white or black magick.
(02:56:10) (ron) lynn. to subdue means for humanity is to overcome
(02:56:18) (Lynn) It´s like electricity. It all depends on HOW you USE it.
(02:56:20) (ron) harmony is good view also
(02:56:47) (Lynn) Let´s appreciate our differences, ron. We do not have to agbre
(02:56:57) (Lynn) agree, or type accurately lol
(02:56:57) (ron) problems are never solved, they are overcome
(02:56:59) (diane) yes...the proper use of anything involves care be taken
(02:57:20) (Lynn) and I , with great respect, disagree, ron
(02:57:38) (diane) aha...sounds like an impending debate
(02:57:40) (Blu) Years ago WIS and I knew a woman who was a practicing witch. She learned her craft from her mother, she from her mother and it was handed down through the female line back to ancient times.
(02:57:45) (Lynn) but I will think about what you said and probably learn something.
(02:57:46) (ron) whatever...has small pocs been solved or overcome?
(02:58:05) (Lynn) solved
(02:58:07) (diane) not overcome
(02:58:09) (ron) for example
(02:58:30) (ron) then there would be no more small pox threats
(02:58:34) (Blu) It was disguised in the Catholic church through the Virgen Mary and she told us we would be surprised by the part of the church that was a secret way of teaching her religion.
(02:58:35) (diane) interesting Blu. meaning they practiced Wicca?
(02:58:51) (Lynn) If we had harmony among life forms and on all levels, there would be no small pox.
(02:59:07) (diane) sounds like Latino version of Catholicism, Blu
(02:59:12) (Blu) no, not Wicca, she woult be insulted and amuzed by them
(02:59:19) (ron) or disease in any form...instead we have overcome their threats which be there just like the plage
(02:59:33) (ron) they can appear at anytime
(02:59:39) (diane) not Wicca...ok. interesting
(02:59:46) (Blu) She was Portuguese
(02:59:54) (Lynn) ron, I enjoy it when you disagree with me. I will think deep on this. I do not like overcomne., I have excessive Libra.
(03:00:33) (Blu) She was suppose to write it all down and tell her story but we lost track of her and I don't know if she ever did
(03:00:56) (Blu) I would be interesting to google and see if she did
(03:00:57) (ron) to overcome the earth with one's will...is that what the readings are saying?...humankinds temptations are still there, are they not?
(03:01:21) (diane) overcome the threat of small pox, but not Solved the threat...hmmm .
(03:01:26) (Blu) they are Ron
(03:01:37) (Lynn) ron, that is what scientists (the mad ones are doing now. Without regard for the harmony of nature and man, science is destroying our earth. I think.
(03:01:45) (ron) yes lynn...i have my own views...no disrespect to you...but i tend to lean towards the Readings
(03:01:47) (diane) temptation is eternal!
(03:02:01) (Lynn) ok lol lol ((ron))
(03:02:07) (Lynn) Now that is my Libra! lol
(03:02:18) (ron) i suppose so diane...i was thinking of earthly temptations etc
(03:02:29) (Lynn) ah, there´s the rub.
(03:02:35) (diane) yep...no end to them
(03:02:41) (Lynn) temptations. I was thinking of nature.
(03:02:57) (Lynn) See, we agree more than we think.
(03:02:58) (ron) Mother Nature?...well
(03:02:58) (diane) how so, as in human nature?
(03:03:22) (Lynn) Man keeps trying to overcome nature instead of cooperating with.
(03:03:40) (Lynn) Temptation, well, I´m still working on that one but I would not cooperate.
(03:03:47) (Blu) man has altered nature to the point of destruction
(03:04:00) (ron) i guess so diane...but, perhaps my thoughts may not be clarified in my own mind...
(03:04:13) (Lynn) I fight temptation AFTER yielding sometimes.
(03:04:24) (Lynn) overcome for next time, maybe
(03:04:29) (ron) temptation is like one not going along with the "flow"
(03:04:41) (ron) thus, temper tantrums etc
(03:04:53) (Lynn) I think the flow would become stagnate water if everyone just went along with the flow.
(03:05:06) (ron) like going against the grain of society
(03:05:17) (Lynn) Do you choose to go along with the flow of crime, pronography, etc? I don´t think so.
(03:05:24) (diane) The Will, directing it to overcome, is the key
(03:05:32) (ron) flow = like not going along with spiritual teachings
(03:05:39) (Lynn) But that is where understanding can harmonize.
(03:05:45) (ron) rather going along with spiritual teachings
(03:06:08) (Lynn) Spiritual teachings, a short time ago, meant burning witches and anyone else who disagreed.
(03:06:18) (ron) oh well...
(03:06:41) (ron) i see a greater context coming into view...
(03:06:42) (Lynn) Whose spiritual teachings. There are preachers who would condemn us.
(03:07:07) (ron) spiritual teachings = Universal Laws
(03:07:12) (Lynn) You go along with my spiritual teachings and you´re cool? I don´t think so. My understandings are mine to be enhanced with yours.
(03:07:24) (ron) i'm getting tired...
(03:07:29) (Lynn) me too
(03:07:29) (ron) oh well...
(03:08:14) (ron) should i start on anaother article?
(03:08:21) (Lynn) please do
(03:08:22) (WalksInSpirit) Sure, Ron!
(03:08:26) (ron) ok
(03:08:55) (ron) ARCTURUS: THE DEVELOPING
(03:09:14) (ron) The Readings tell us that we can also have between-life sojourns on the Fixed Stars. Arcturus is the ultimate achievement in planetary sojourns. Arcturus is a red giant 113 times brighter than our Sun. It is about 36 light years from our Earth in the Constellation of BOOTES.
(03:10:04) (ron) 3 + 6 = 9...number of completion...light of understanding
(03:10:27) (ron) Cayce tells us that once a soul has achieved perfection in the earth plane, it goes to the star of Arcturus and from there on to other systems.
(03:10:46) (ron) other systems?
(03:10:59) (ron) For, as long as an entity is within the confines of that termed the earth's and the sons of the earth's solar system, the developments are within the sojourns of the entity from sphere to sphere; and when completed it begins - throughout the music of the spheres with Arcturus, Polaris, and through those sojourns in the outer sphere. 441-1
(03:11:31) (ron) In this we find the relations as given from those spheres in the earth's sphere; that is, as in Mercury, as in Venus, as in Mars, as in Jupiter, as in Earth, as in Uranus, as in Neptune, and the chancing, or changing, as it were, from one development to another, until the entity passes from that solar system, or sphere, through Arcturus or Septimus, as we see. 900-25
(03:12:11) (ron) even completion thru Septimus...that is new to me
(03:12:43) (ron) As an entity passes on, as has been given, from this present - or THIS solar system, THIS sun, THESE forces, it passes through the various spheres - which - known as Arcturus - nearer the Pleiades, in this passage about the various spheres - on and ON - through the EONS of time, as called - or space - which is ONE in the various spheres of its activity;
(03:13:22) (ron) through the EONS of time, as called - or space -
(03:13:34) (ron) even passing into the inner forces, INNER sense, may they again - after a period of nearly ten THOUSAND years - may an entity enter into the earth to make manifest those forces gained in ITS passage. 311-2
(03:13:57) (ron) Cayce says that Arcturus is a great Sun around which the activity in this environ rotates.
(03:14:17) (ron) Galactic Center
(03:14:31) (ron) i believe is being mentioned here
(03:14:45) (ron) Also we find the Sun and Arcturus, the greater Sun, giving of the strength in mental and spiritual elements toward developing of soul and of the attributes toward the better forces in earth's spheres. 137-4
(03:15:13) (ron) For Arcturus is that junction between the spheres of activity as related to cosmic force, and is that about which this particular environ or sphere of activity rotates, or is a relative source of activity. 263-15
(03:15:34) (ron) The way to achieve a sojourn to Arcturus is by perfection in the conquering of self.
(03:16:09) (ron) conquering...?...hmmm...
(03:16:28) (ron) In a word, MUCH has been made of the PRESENT experience, and it will lie within the own desire of the entity as to whether the return in earth's experience becomes necessary or not; for the Arcturus' forces, these become all magnified in will's force, and the conquering of self is truly greater than were one to conquer MANY worlds, and IS conquering those of OUR, or of our SUN'S own attributes. 115-1
(03:17:07) (ron) Perfected souls go to Arcturus, while souls that still need reforming go to Saturn.
(03:17:44) (ron) souls that still need reforming go to Saturn....my ole friend Scratch
(03:18:00) (diane) lol
(03:18:03) (ron) Also the relationship of the sojourn in the various elements that have to do with the spheres as related to earth's sphere - the variations from one passing through Arcturus to other forces, or returning to Saturn! 256-1
(03:18:56) (ron) When a soul goes to Arcturus, it has to make a choice as to whether it will go on to other systems or return to earth to help. Edgar Cayce made his choice after his past life as a Persian leader named Uhjltd (pronounced YOOLT).
(03:19:48) (ron) Q. The sixth problem concerns interplanetary and inter-system dwelling, between earthly lives. It was given through this source that the entity Edgar Cayce, after the experience as Uhjltd, went to the system of Arcturus, and then returned to earth. Does this indicate a usual or an unusual step in soul evolution?
(03:20:24) (ron) A. As indicated, or as has been indicated in other sources besides this as respecting this very problem - Arcturus is that which may be called the center of this universe, through which individuals pass and at which period there comes the choice of the individual as to whether it is to return to complete there -
(03:21:01) (ron) universe = our galactic system
(03:21:15) (ron) that is, in this planetary system, our sun, the earth sun and its planetary system - or to pass on to others. This was an unusual step, and yet a usual one. 5749-14
(03:21:40) (ron) Arcturus comes in the entity's chart, or as a central force from which the entity came again into the earth-material sojourns. For, this is the way, the door out of this system. Yet purposefully did the entity return in this experience. 2454-3
(03:22:09) (ron) But beginning with Mercury, the entity has run the gamut even unto Neptune and Arcturus, and then returned to earth. 3637-1
(03:22:23) (ron) Here is a poetic description of the beauty of an Arcturian sojourn.
(03:22:43) (ron) In those experiences of the entity in its dwellings in the hills and the plains of Persia, also in Egypt, the beauties and music of the spheres sang and brought into the experience of the entity its studies of the light by day, the joy of the voices of the night, and the star that led the entity - that source from which it may gain so much of its strength in the present;
(03:23:19) (ron) ARCTURUS, the wonderful, the beautiful! As the bright and GLORIOUS light from same set afire, as it were, its meditations in the plains, so may the illuminations do the same in the lives of these the entity contacts through its gentleness and kindness and service.
(03:23:49) (ron) For he that would gain the understanding POURS OUT, even as upon the desert sand, the refreshing liberation of the spirit of truth the rises to the Throne of grace as sweet incense before the Giver of life and light and understanding, and immortality in Him! 827-1
(03:23:59) (ron) END for today...OPEN CHAT
(03:24:26) (Lynn) thank you
(03:24:31) (ron) For he that would gain the understanding POURS OUT, even as upon the desert sand,
(03:24:35) (diane) Arcturus is heaven?
(03:24:38) (WalksInSpirit) Great chat today, Ron! Thank you!
(03:25:13) (Lynn) what are you saying to us, ron. There is something important I´m not getting. POURS OUT, what?
(03:25:46) (diane) This was an unusual step, and yet a usual one. 5749-14 Does that mean many return to earth from Arcturus?
(03:25:50) (ron) not really diane...it is a doorway to other and greater experiences as well as being a continued service to those left behind still dealing with their earthly struggles
(03:26:10) (diane) ty ron
(02:32:01) (ron) "We three Kings of Orient are, bearing gifts we travel afar...," and so go the lyrics to the popular Christmas carol with which we are so familiar. It was written of course to commemorate the arrival of the Magi, or Wise Men, at the birth of the Christ Child. However, according to the Cayce readings, these visitors were not really kings and there were more than three of them,
(02:32:39) (ron) arriving in several different groups from at least five different countries. In addition, although the modern Church celebrates their visitation on January 6, Cayce tells us that they were not actually presented to the Child until after the time of Mary's purification in accordance with Jewish Law (29 to 40 days after birth). (5749-7)
(02:33:26) (ron) Cayce's expanded story comes together over multiple readings, including two in which individuals were told that they had been the Wise Men of the Nativity story in previous lives.
(02:33:47) (ron) In Cayce's narrative, the true purpose and meaning of the gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh is explained, and we are even told why one group was routed through Herod rather than directly to the Christ Child. The readings also point out that the Wise Men's visit served to provide encouragement and support to Mary and those around her.
(02:34:20) (ron) WHAT THE BIBLE TELLS US
(02:34:43) (ron) Despite the additional detail, amazingly, the Cayce readings do not contradict the story we are told in the New Testament. One reason for this is that the Magi are mentioned briefly in only one of the books of the New Testament (Matthew 2: 1-16).
(02:35:11) (ron) Not only that, the actual number of Wise Men is not noted. Bible scholars speculate that the tradition of the number three was taken from the number of gifts given (gold, frankincense, and myrrh). The Cayce readings indicate that there may have been as many as five different groups arriving before, during, and after the birth (although none were presented until the proper time).
(02:35:52) (ron) We are told in the Scriptures that the Magi had received a revelation of sorts and were following a star that they believed would lead them to the newly born "King of the Jews." For some reason they stopped in Jerusalem to inquire of the Child's whereabouts. Herod, the current head of the Jewish government under the Romans, felt immediately threatened and conspired with his chief scribes to use the Magi to locate this potential rival. The Magi, however, were direc
(02:36:27) (ron) dream not to return to Herod with the information. As a result, Herod ordered the death of all children in the area under the age of two years. Joseph, warned in a dream to flee with the Child to Egypt, escaped with the family.
(02:36:56) (ron) WERE THE WISE MEN SPIRITUAL ADEPTS?
(02:37:27) (ron) Although Bible scholars believe that the Wise Men came from Persia, Matthew's gospel does not specify the country of origin, just that they came from the East. Cayce states specifically that "They came from Persia, India, Egypt, and also from Chaldea, Gobi (China), and what is NOW the Indo or Tao land." (2067-7)
(02:37:58) (ron) Asimov's Guide to the New Testament states that the Persian priests of the ancient Zoroastrian religion were called "magu," which in Latin becomes "magi." This is particularly interesting, since the Cayce readings indicate that a previous incarnation of the Christ soul was Zend, the father of Zoroaster.
(02:38:31) (ron) The Jewish Encyclopedia tells us that the term magi was given to magicians from the Babylonian and Egyptian religions. The practice of magic was common throughout ancient Israel and the Middle East, especially among scholars. So-called white magic was differentiated from black
(02:39:01) (ron) magic (sorcery and worship of false gods) and was used primarily to counteract the latter form or for healing. "It was, however, only the practice of witchcraft that was prohibited, for a knowledge of magic was indispensable to a member of the chief councilor of the judiciary..."
(02:39:39) (ron) It appears that white magic may have been a blanket term given to practices we would today list under psychic ability. In the Talmud, for example, Jesus is regarded as a magician. It is also noted that portions of these traditions, although condemned by some Hebrew factions, are said to be contained in the Kabala teachings.
(02:40:16) (ron) In the life readings for the former Wise Men, Cayce describes them as being both very spiritual and very intelligent and as having skills in astrology, astronomy, and mathematics. (256-1; 1908-1) They were spiritual seekers who were very much aware of the Hebrew Messianic prophecies.
(02:40:47) (ron) skills in astrology, astronomy, and mathematics. (256-1; 1908-1)
(02:41:04) (ron) In one reading, Cayce refers to the Wise Men as "...those that subdued - not that were ruled by, but subdued the understandings of that in the earth - were considered, or were in the position of the wise, or the sages, or the ones that were holy; in body and mind, in accord with purposes." He further indicates that they found their way to the Christ Child "...in and through the application of those forces - as ye would term today psychic" (5749-7)
(02:41:34) (ron) to subdue the earth?...with what?...one's will?
(02:41:55) (Lynn) the understanding to work in harmony with
(02:42:09) (ron) ESSENE RECORDS HIDDEN IN PYRAMID
(02:42:41) (ron) Cayce also tells us that the Wise Men had spent time studying records of ancient wisdom kept in Egypt. It was from these records that they knew about the coming of the Messiah and the preparations made by a Jewish sect known as the Essenes. (1010-17
(02:43:10) (ron) An Essene teacher by the name of Judy was in charge of the records. She sent the first group of Wise Men to Herod in an attempt to undermine his relationship with the Romans and thus topple him from his throne. Her plan backfired and ultimately caused the death of many innocent children. As a result, she was told that, in this lifetime, she had to learn not to sit in judgment of others, regardless of their sins. (1472-3)
(02:43:57) (ron) my comment on "to subdue the earth" was that i was referring to the Bible, i believe is in the 2nd chapter of Genesis
(02:44:16) (Lynn) ok, mine the same
(02:44:22) (ron) could be the 1st chapter..forgot which
(02:44:36) (Lynn) I know
(02:45:08) (ron) Both Judy and another Essene teacher, Josie, were responsible for assisting in Jesus' education during his studies in Egypt, Persia and India. In fact, a reading given in July of 1932 asserts that records of this training were located in a pyramid "yet to be uncovered," and that the records might come to light between 1936 and 1940, "When there has been sufficient of the reckoning through which the world is passing in the present..." (5749-2)
(02:45:54) (ron) The readings also seem to indicate that these records contain the information studied by the Wise Men. Some have speculated that the 13 papyrus books found in Nag Hammadi, Egypt, in 1945 and/or the Dead Sea Scrolls, discovered shortly thereafter, could be the information to which Cayce was referring.
(02:46:22) (ron) Cayce also indicated that Herod's wife, who had contact with both the Essenes and the Wise Men, had written a history of this time period, which was lost with the destruction of the Alexandria library. (2067-1) In his recent book, An American Prophet, Sidney Kirkpatrick states that portions of this narrative may still exist in the Vatican Library.
(02:46:57) (ron) may still exist in the Vatican Library.
(02:47:12) (ron) THE MEANING OF THE GIFTS
(02:47:44) (ron) In one reading, regarding the training of the Christ Child by the Essenes, Cayce was asked, "What relation was there in the training with the three wise men?"
(02:48:12) (ron) His answer was that the presentation of the gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh by the Magi was a highly significant ritual, which prefigured the future development of Jesus and his initiation into his ministry later in life.
(02:48:36) (ron) "So they represent in the metaphysical sense the three phases of man's experience in materiality; gold, the material; frankincense, the ether or ethereal; myrrh, the healing force as brought with same; or body, mind, soul." (5749-7)
(02:49:17) (ron) Charles Filmore notes in the Metaphysical Dictionary that the Wise Men are archetypal symbols which represent "the wisdom that is carried within the soul from previous incarnations. They are the inner realms of consciousness that, like books of life, have kept the records of past lives and held them in reserve for the great day when the soul would receive the supreme ego, Jesus."
(02:49:56) (ron) ego...i like my ego
(02:50:11) (ron) In other words, they represent our higher self and our inner essence or individuality, as Cayce termed it. This inner wisdom serves to encourage and support our preparation for the birth of the Christ Consciousness into our limited consciousness.
(02:50:38) (Lynn) that is meaningful, ron
(02:50:43) (ron) WHAT HAPPENED TO THE WISE MEN?
(02:51:15) (ron) The Cayce CDROM contains a magazine excerpt from 1967 recounting the Church tradition that the Wise Men were baptized by St. Thomas in India 40 years after Bethlehem. They were subsequently ordained as Christian priests and eventually martyred for their faith. Their bodies were supposedly buried in the mosque of St. Sophia at Constantinople, later moved to a Cathedral in Milan, Italy, and then to Cologne, Germany.
(02:51:51) (ron) The Dictionary of Saints by John Delaney notes a first century tradition identifying the three Magi as Balthasar, Caspar, and Melchior. They were believed to be astrologers from Babylonia and Arabia and have been deemed the patron saints of travelers.
(02:52:13) (ron) believed to be astrologers
(02:52:47) (Lynn) some versions still translate wisemen as astrologers, ron
(02:52:56) (ron) END...i hope all of you found this article to be very informative...such things are always a learning thing for me
(02:53:09) (Lynn) very meaningful to me
(02:53:24) (ron) take a break...i have another article...if you wish
(02:53:48) (diane) great material ron. Sounds familiar to me
(02:54:08) (Lynn) I love what was said about subdue the earth. Subduing is not conquering. To subdue is to understand and work in harmony with.
(02:54:22) (ron) thank you lynn...appreciate your thoughts
(02:54:22) (Lynn) Then there is love given and received.
(02:55:10) (Lynn) You must do a good deal of work to find just the correct writings for your classes. They always have rich surface and rich deep meanings, ron.
(02:55:13) (diane) that makes sense
(02:55:21) (diane) Agree Lynn!
(02:55:24) (Lynn) for me
(02:55:25) (ron) thanks
(02:56:07) (Lynn) I would like to say that there is no such thing as white or black magick.
(02:56:10) (ron) lynn. to subdue means for humanity is to overcome
(02:56:18) (Lynn) It´s like electricity. It all depends on HOW you USE it.
(02:56:20) (ron) harmony is good view also
(02:56:47) (Lynn) Let´s appreciate our differences, ron. We do not have to agbre
(02:56:57) (Lynn) agree, or type accurately lol
(02:56:57) (ron) problems are never solved, they are overcome
(02:56:59) (diane) yes...the proper use of anything involves care be taken
(02:57:20) (Lynn) and I , with great respect, disagree, ron
(02:57:38) (diane) aha...sounds like an impending debate
(02:57:40) (Blu) Years ago WIS and I knew a woman who was a practicing witch. She learned her craft from her mother, she from her mother and it was handed down through the female line back to ancient times.
(02:57:45) (Lynn) but I will think about what you said and probably learn something.
(02:57:46) (ron) whatever...has small pocs been solved or overcome?
(02:58:05) (Lynn) solved
(02:58:07) (diane) not overcome
(02:58:09) (ron) for example
(02:58:30) (ron) then there would be no more small pox threats
(02:58:34) (Blu) It was disguised in the Catholic church through the Virgen Mary and she told us we would be surprised by the part of the church that was a secret way of teaching her religion.
(02:58:35) (diane) interesting Blu. meaning they practiced Wicca?
(02:58:51) (Lynn) If we had harmony among life forms and on all levels, there would be no small pox.
(02:59:07) (diane) sounds like Latino version of Catholicism, Blu
(02:59:12) (Blu) no, not Wicca, she woult be insulted and amuzed by them
(02:59:19) (ron) or disease in any form...instead we have overcome their threats which be there just like the plage
(02:59:33) (ron) they can appear at anytime
(02:59:39) (diane) not Wicca...ok. interesting
(02:59:46) (Blu) She was Portuguese
(02:59:54) (Lynn) ron, I enjoy it when you disagree with me. I will think deep on this. I do not like overcomne., I have excessive Libra.
(03:00:33) (Blu) She was suppose to write it all down and tell her story but we lost track of her and I don't know if she ever did
(03:00:56) (Blu) I would be interesting to google and see if she did
(03:00:57) (ron) to overcome the earth with one's will...is that what the readings are saying?...humankinds temptations are still there, are they not?
(03:01:21) (diane) overcome the threat of small pox, but not Solved the threat...hmmm .
(03:01:26) (Blu) they are Ron
(03:01:37) (Lynn) ron, that is what scientists (the mad ones are doing now. Without regard for the harmony of nature and man, science is destroying our earth. I think.
(03:01:45) (ron) yes lynn...i have my own views...no disrespect to you...but i tend to lean towards the Readings
(03:01:47) (diane) temptation is eternal!
(03:02:01) (Lynn) ok lol lol ((ron))
(03:02:07) (Lynn) Now that is my Libra! lol
(03:02:18) (ron) i suppose so diane...i was thinking of earthly temptations etc
(03:02:29) (Lynn) ah, there´s the rub.
(03:02:35) (diane) yep...no end to them
(03:02:41) (Lynn) temptations. I was thinking of nature.
(03:02:57) (Lynn) See, we agree more than we think.
(03:02:58) (ron) Mother Nature?...well
(03:02:58) (diane) how so, as in human nature?
(03:03:22) (Lynn) Man keeps trying to overcome nature instead of cooperating with.
(03:03:40) (Lynn) Temptation, well, I´m still working on that one but I would not cooperate.
(03:03:47) (Blu) man has altered nature to the point of destruction
(03:04:00) (ron) i guess so diane...but, perhaps my thoughts may not be clarified in my own mind...
(03:04:13) (Lynn) I fight temptation AFTER yielding sometimes.
(03:04:24) (Lynn) overcome for next time, maybe
(03:04:29) (ron) temptation is like one not going along with the "flow"
(03:04:41) (ron) thus, temper tantrums etc
(03:04:53) (Lynn) I think the flow would become stagnate water if everyone just went along with the flow.
(03:05:06) (ron) like going against the grain of society
(03:05:17) (Lynn) Do you choose to go along with the flow of crime, pronography, etc? I don´t think so.
(03:05:24) (diane) The Will, directing it to overcome, is the key
(03:05:32) (ron) flow = like not going along with spiritual teachings
(03:05:39) (Lynn) But that is where understanding can harmonize.
(03:05:45) (ron) rather going along with spiritual teachings
(03:06:08) (Lynn) Spiritual teachings, a short time ago, meant burning witches and anyone else who disagreed.
(03:06:18) (ron) oh well...
(03:06:41) (ron) i see a greater context coming into view...
(03:06:42) (Lynn) Whose spiritual teachings. There are preachers who would condemn us.
(03:07:07) (ron) spiritual teachings = Universal Laws
(03:07:12) (Lynn) You go along with my spiritual teachings and you´re cool? I don´t think so. My understandings are mine to be enhanced with yours.
(03:07:24) (ron) i'm getting tired...
(03:07:29) (Lynn) me too
(03:07:29) (ron) oh well...
(03:08:14) (ron) should i start on anaother article?
(03:08:21) (Lynn) please do
(03:08:22) (WalksInSpirit) Sure, Ron!
(03:08:26) (ron) ok
(03:08:55) (ron) ARCTURUS: THE DEVELOPING
(03:09:14) (ron) The Readings tell us that we can also have between-life sojourns on the Fixed Stars. Arcturus is the ultimate achievement in planetary sojourns. Arcturus is a red giant 113 times brighter than our Sun. It is about 36 light years from our Earth in the Constellation of BOOTES.
(03:10:04) (ron) 3 + 6 = 9...number of completion...light of understanding
(03:10:27) (ron) Cayce tells us that once a soul has achieved perfection in the earth plane, it goes to the star of Arcturus and from there on to other systems.
(03:10:46) (ron) other systems?
(03:10:59) (ron) For, as long as an entity is within the confines of that termed the earth's and the sons of the earth's solar system, the developments are within the sojourns of the entity from sphere to sphere; and when completed it begins - throughout the music of the spheres with Arcturus, Polaris, and through those sojourns in the outer sphere. 441-1
(03:11:31) (ron) In this we find the relations as given from those spheres in the earth's sphere; that is, as in Mercury, as in Venus, as in Mars, as in Jupiter, as in Earth, as in Uranus, as in Neptune, and the chancing, or changing, as it were, from one development to another, until the entity passes from that solar system, or sphere, through Arcturus or Septimus, as we see. 900-25
(03:12:11) (ron) even completion thru Septimus...that is new to me
(03:12:43) (ron) As an entity passes on, as has been given, from this present - or THIS solar system, THIS sun, THESE forces, it passes through the various spheres - which - known as Arcturus - nearer the Pleiades, in this passage about the various spheres - on and ON - through the EONS of time, as called - or space - which is ONE in the various spheres of its activity;
(03:13:22) (ron) through the EONS of time, as called - or space -
(03:13:34) (ron) even passing into the inner forces, INNER sense, may they again - after a period of nearly ten THOUSAND years - may an entity enter into the earth to make manifest those forces gained in ITS passage. 311-2
(03:13:57) (ron) Cayce says that Arcturus is a great Sun around which the activity in this environ rotates.
(03:14:17) (ron) Galactic Center
(03:14:31) (ron) i believe is being mentioned here
(03:14:45) (ron) Also we find the Sun and Arcturus, the greater Sun, giving of the strength in mental and spiritual elements toward developing of soul and of the attributes toward the better forces in earth's spheres. 137-4
(03:15:13) (ron) For Arcturus is that junction between the spheres of activity as related to cosmic force, and is that about which this particular environ or sphere of activity rotates, or is a relative source of activity. 263-15
(03:15:34) (ron) The way to achieve a sojourn to Arcturus is by perfection in the conquering of self.
(03:16:09) (ron) conquering...?...hmmm...
(03:16:28) (ron) In a word, MUCH has been made of the PRESENT experience, and it will lie within the own desire of the entity as to whether the return in earth's experience becomes necessary or not; for the Arcturus' forces, these become all magnified in will's force, and the conquering of self is truly greater than were one to conquer MANY worlds, and IS conquering those of OUR, or of our SUN'S own attributes. 115-1
(03:17:07) (ron) Perfected souls go to Arcturus, while souls that still need reforming go to Saturn.
(03:17:44) (ron) souls that still need reforming go to Saturn....my ole friend Scratch
(03:18:00) (diane) lol
(03:18:03) (ron) Also the relationship of the sojourn in the various elements that have to do with the spheres as related to earth's sphere - the variations from one passing through Arcturus to other forces, or returning to Saturn! 256-1
(03:18:56) (ron) When a soul goes to Arcturus, it has to make a choice as to whether it will go on to other systems or return to earth to help. Edgar Cayce made his choice after his past life as a Persian leader named Uhjltd (pronounced YOOLT).
(03:19:48) (ron) Q. The sixth problem concerns interplanetary and inter-system dwelling, between earthly lives. It was given through this source that the entity Edgar Cayce, after the experience as Uhjltd, went to the system of Arcturus, and then returned to earth. Does this indicate a usual or an unusual step in soul evolution?
(03:20:24) (ron) A. As indicated, or as has been indicated in other sources besides this as respecting this very problem - Arcturus is that which may be called the center of this universe, through which individuals pass and at which period there comes the choice of the individual as to whether it is to return to complete there -
(03:21:01) (ron) universe = our galactic system
(03:21:15) (ron) that is, in this planetary system, our sun, the earth sun and its planetary system - or to pass on to others. This was an unusual step, and yet a usual one. 5749-14
(03:21:40) (ron) Arcturus comes in the entity's chart, or as a central force from which the entity came again into the earth-material sojourns. For, this is the way, the door out of this system. Yet purposefully did the entity return in this experience. 2454-3
(03:22:09) (ron) But beginning with Mercury, the entity has run the gamut even unto Neptune and Arcturus, and then returned to earth. 3637-1
(03:22:23) (ron) Here is a poetic description of the beauty of an Arcturian sojourn.
(03:22:43) (ron) In those experiences of the entity in its dwellings in the hills and the plains of Persia, also in Egypt, the beauties and music of the spheres sang and brought into the experience of the entity its studies of the light by day, the joy of the voices of the night, and the star that led the entity - that source from which it may gain so much of its strength in the present;
(03:23:19) (ron) ARCTURUS, the wonderful, the beautiful! As the bright and GLORIOUS light from same set afire, as it were, its meditations in the plains, so may the illuminations do the same in the lives of these the entity contacts through its gentleness and kindness and service.
(03:23:49) (ron) For he that would gain the understanding POURS OUT, even as upon the desert sand, the refreshing liberation of the spirit of truth the rises to the Throne of grace as sweet incense before the Giver of life and light and understanding, and immortality in Him! 827-1
(03:23:59) (ron) END for today...OPEN CHAT
(03:24:26) (Lynn) thank you
(03:24:31) (ron) For he that would gain the understanding POURS OUT, even as upon the desert sand,
(03:24:35) (diane) Arcturus is heaven?
(03:24:38) (WalksInSpirit) Great chat today, Ron! Thank you!
(03:25:13) (Lynn) what are you saying to us, ron. There is something important I´m not getting. POURS OUT, what?
(03:25:46) (diane) This was an unusual step, and yet a usual one. 5749-14 Does that mean many return to earth from Arcturus?
(03:25:50) (ron) not really diane...it is a doorway to other and greater experiences as well as being a continued service to those left behind still dealing with their earthly struggles
(03:26:10) (diane) ty ron
