Post by WalksInSpirit on Sept 11, 2007 21:50:55 GMT -5
Healing Stones Chat: 09-11-07
(09:20:36) (~AutoGreeter) Good Evening. The Red Path Chat Room welcomes you to Healing Stones Chat, Hosted By Cris.
(09:21:20) (Cris) Marcel Vogel did some interesting experiements with quartz
(09:21:45) (Cris) I am going to talk about his life and experiments a bit tonight
(09:22:33) (Cris) I'm going to get started
(09:22:50) (Cris) Lord and Protector of all please be with us on our spiritual journey as we seek a higher plane of thought. Let us see opportunity to work in your grace as we come together to seek peace in this world. Amen
(09:23:03) (@gg) Amen
(09:23:04) (patricia) Amen
(09:23:08) (~WalksInSpirit) Nunwe
(09:23:16) (~Blu) Amen
(09:23:22) (mabel) amen
(09:26:18) (Cris) This chat will tell a little about Marcel Vogel and his work. Some of his crystal cuts have proven that quartz has the ability to assist in the physical healing process. Later scientific experiments did show that some of his designs seem to facilitate healing under certain conditions.
(09:26:59) (Cris) Marcel Joseph Vogel, born in San Francisco in 1917, was revived after being pronounced dead at the age of six from pneumonia. At this time, Vogel encountered a near-death experience (NDE). It caused him to question the meaning of life. Every day, from the age of six, he walked to early morning Mass to pray and questioned the purpose of his existence.
(09:27:38) (Cris) At age 12, an answer came as a "voice" that told Marcel he would be a "phosphor chemist" doing work in luminescence. Majoring in chemistry and physics at the University of San Francisco, Vogel found little written, or taught, in the field of luminescence.
(09:28:09) (Cris) So he translated articles he found written in German on phosphors. Due to deteriorating health, he left college and completed his education privately, with Dr. Peter Pringsheim, a German professor.
(09:28:46) (Cris) Vogel published papers and formed his own corporation, Vogel Luminescence. The company pioneered in the manufacturing of fluorescent paints, oils, crayons, chalk, Day-Glo colors, invisible ink, and tagging and tracing powders—used to detect bacteria and disease, including cancer.
(09:29:12) (Cris) He worked part-time for IBM and he became a senior research scientist in 1957. He remained with IBM until 1984, when he founded his own lab, Psychic Research, Inc.
(09:29:32) (Cris) I am giving his background so you realize the man was not a crackpot
(09:29:44) (~Blu) cool guy
(09:29:52) (Raleigh) :)
(09:30:06) (Cris) He was very interesting and so was his work
(09:30:23) (Cris) During the time he was employed with IBM he received numerous patents for his inventions. Among these was the magnetic coating for the 24†hard disc drive systems. He also worked with the first liquid crystal displays, or LCD, and researched the effect of the mind and emotion on plants.
(09:31:01) (Cris) He eventually began to use raw, single terminated quartz crystals. By pointing the crystal at another person, he discovered that the crystal amplified thoughts and emotions, often putting the individual into an altered state of consciousness.
(09:31:47) (Cris) Vogel's work with human & plant communication experiments led to his discovery of an intelligent matrix existing in crystal/liquid crystal with an ability to store, amplify, and transfer information, and that crystal can be altered during its growth stage.
(09:32:00) (merri) what is "terminated" quartz crystals?
(09:32:12) (patricia) point
(09:32:24) (Cris) pointed at the end the natural growth to a point
(09:32:33) (merri) TY
(09:32:53) (Cris) some crystals have a single termination or point some are double terminated at both ends
(09:33:40) (Cris) pointed at both ends naturally these are free floating in the ground or in pockets at times
(09:34:08) (Cris) Seventeen years of research in this area led to his faceted crystal inventions, useful in laser applications. Vogel was also working on the structuring of water for purification purposes, and the structuring of wines to rapidly age them.
(09:35:32) (Cris) I have a lot of information on his water and wine experiments but it would take several sessions to do it justice. He purified them with crystals, thought, magnetic forces etc.
(09:35:50) (Cris) For tonight we are focusing on his crystals
(09:36:41) (Cris) The above experiments were not simply crystal programming they involved other applications
(09:36:59) (Cris) After leaving IBM, Vogel continued his research on the use of quartz crystals and their ability to heal people. He founded a group dedicated to intensive research into healing energies, especially those of various shapes of quartz crystals.
(09:38:41) (Cris) He cut a lot of quartz, not always crystals in to various shapes to see which might heal better. One piece I read said he also melted quartz and reshaped it. Another practice that is appearing recently on the market
(09:39:01) (Cris) Vogel knew that the real origin of illness is in the etheric body. Although the body or emotions sustain a trauma, the etheric body holds the memory of physical or emotional injury and it can become stagnant, distorted, or stuck. The result of this unstable or blocked energy is illness. He discovered that crystals are the common thread in healing that ties together energy, illness, and problems in the etheric body.
(09:39:46) (Cris) Whenever light from the higher realms comes into a person's body, the light gets refracted if the etheric body is not stable. This can cause illness. The Vogel cut crystal is supposed to give the user immediate access to the etheric body and stabilizes it, allowing light from the higher realms to enter.
(09:40:13) (@gg) How interesting.
(09:40:24) (Raleigh) no kidden
(09:40:29) (patricia) Yes, very
(09:40:41) (mabel) what kind of cut is it?
(09:40:46) (Raleigh) ive not heard of melting quartz either /
(09:40:52) (Cris) Some healers says his quartz cuts work very well others say it is in the quartz programming
(09:41:18) (Cris) It is done in labs to create perfectly shaped crystals Ral
(09:41:27) (Raleigh) k
(09:41:35) (Cris) Those in nature have growth marks and small flaws
(09:41:57) (Cris) These crystals are not cheap prices for the small size healing crystals, approximately 3 inches in length, and 1.5 inches across, range from $450 to $600. Over the years the Vogel cut crystals have climbed in price as demands for them from healers have increased. There are many sites that sell these and other Vogel designed crystals for hige sums of money
(09:42:29) (MarkH) our commom drinking glass's is made of quartz?
(09:42:33) (merri) WoW
(09:43:11) (Cris) I admire Vogels work and think he was truly on to something when he passed on
(09:43:36) (mabel) is his work being carried on now?
(09:43:41) (Cris) His work at that time began to put the accent on programming rather than cut or shape
(09:43:56) (~WalksInSpirit) Glassware is lead crystal instead of quartz crystal, ennit?
(09:44:16) (merri) so why the high price for the cut crystal
(09:44:23) (Cris) Glass is made from sand and a lot of that is quartz
(09:44:57) (MarkH) so we can program our glass ware
(09:45:03) (MarkH) maybe
(09:45:06) (Cris) Specialty shape and a limited suply to keep the price artifically high
(09:45:07) (merri) LOL
(09:45:19) (Cris) I wouldn't try Mark
(09:45:28) (Cris) Do they actually work better than a plain crystal? Some healers and scientists argue that any quartz matching the vibrations of the person using them show the same effects. Reiki and Healing Touch practitioners using both plain and Vogel crystals think that the programming of the crystal is what matters in working with their patients.
(09:46:01) (Cris) Even Vogel was beginning to waver on the shape at the end
(09:46:22) (Raleigh) i will need see his work for sure / i had fun trying to figure out the shape of the atlantean firestone /
(09:46:31) (Cris) The company making the Vogel cut disagree they say that cutting quartz to these dimensions produces an instrument that has the same vibration as structured water. That this is highly significant because human bodies are composed primarily of water. This makes the Vogel Wand a powerful and effective healing tool.
(09:47:17) (Cris) The Vogel crystal is programmed by those using it
(09:47:23) (merri) well naturally they would say that
(09:47:36) (merri) at 450 a shot!
(09:47:56) (mabel) alot of money for a crystal
(09:47:56) (Cris) although Vogel himself called it a slightly different thing.
(09:48:03) (Cris) Yes it is
(09:48:16) (Cris) In my own experience of becoming a Reiki practitioner and using stones for healing I have noted that many things affect the quality and the speed of healing. The most important is the person's desire to be healed. The second is keeping myself as a clear channel for the healing energy to come through.
(09:48:32) (ron1) hinders a needed oportunity at such a price...
(09:49:01) (Cris) Agree Ron
(09:49:18) (Cris) When I use quartz crystals of any kind, clear, amethyst, milky or smoky it is important that these stones were properly cleared, cleaned and programmed before using them on someone desiring a treatment. I haven't felt that specific cuts enhance the process at this time. Edgar Cayce didn't advocate specific cuts in his readings. However, it could be because these specific cuts came after his passing.
(09:49:58) (Cris) Or because as he stressed it is the vibration of the stone
(09:50:07) (@gg) It would seem to me that the natural crystal would be more effective.
(09:50:21) (Raleigh) thats what i think too gg
(09:50:24) (Cris) I feel it is the vibration working with the body that matters more than shape
(09:50:34) (Cris) I do too Lory
(09:50:45) (Cris) As a rockhound I am very familiar with the need of dealers to recoup their expenses in setting up a shop or a booth at a show. They lovingly display machine cut wands of quartz, fluorite or feldspar touting their healing abilities. The buyer should be aware that you are buying the stones for their vibrations not their cuts.
(09:51:52) (Cris) I do not discount the findings of Marcel Vogel because he held over 100 patents in his name and was known for his creativity. During the eulogy given at his funeral this was said about him:
(09:52:30) (Cris) From a fellow researcher: I was one of a group of 16 physicians privileged to work with him over a number of years with body energies, especially the capacity to focus healing energies with crystals in the treatment of illness. All of us had an extensive background in acupuncture and appreciated the ability to manipulate body energies.
(09:53:06) (Cris) Under Marcel's guidance, some of us began to learn the process of transmitting thought, especially loving thoughts, unconditionally, to our patients. It brought us an even greater capacity to appreciate the power of the mind to influence illness, the power both to heal and exacerbate disease. And, most important all, to appreciate the incredible presence of unconditional love and it's capacity to trigger transformative shifts
(09:54:00) (Cris) Marcel served for me as a spiritual mentor. He was a truly devout, yet iconoclast Catholic with a passionate love for Christ, and whose devotion was part of his very breathing. Yet he embraced with a deep understanding the teaching the Eastern religions with an especial love and admiration for the Lord Buddha.
(09:54:22) (Cris) He possessed the ability to see beyond the confines and formal structure of church teaching to appreciate the underlying principles in all devout religions. Marcel would have been just as comfortable in a Tibetan monastery as he was in this Church. And just as comfortable and compatible in the presence of the Dalai Lama as he would in the presence of the Pope.
(09:54:51) (Cris) Marcel emphasized the power of meditation to heal and guide our lives
(09:55:09) (Cris) The above speaks volumes about this man who brought crystals to the attention of the scientific world. Even in the eulogy the doctor who worked with him speaks of using the mind to influence matter - programming the crystals. I am not discouraging anyone from trying them but you should keep a journal as I do to compare your results.
(09:56:18) (Cris) The healing stones that I have bought commercially do not work any better or faster than the natural crystals most of us can collect
(09:56:28) (@gg) The programming baffles me a bit, Cris. Why would not prayer asking for a blessing, be sufficient?
(09:56:56) (@gg) Or is that part of the programming of which you speak?
(09:56:59) (Cris) It can be Lory because I pray when I program my crystals to work for the highest good
(09:57:24) (Cris) If it is not for the highest good it will rebound to you
(09:57:38) (Cris) See the above statements saying that Marcel Vogel taught the physicians to pass on unconditional loving thoughts to their patients. Marcel also used thoughts to do what he called influence (program) his quartz crystals
(09:57:46) (@gg) As do all things that are of the Universe and God.
(09:58:12) (Cris) Using thoughts to influence and programing are two ways of saying the same thing
(09:58:26) (Cris) Marcel Vogel's experiences with quartz and water show that the crystals can be a purifying agent. His experiments demonstrated that structure of quartz can replicate itself in water. Something we did with both the rose quartz and amethyst pebbles.
(09:58:54) (Cris) We did those experiments as a group earlier this year
(09:59:12) (Cris) I did not bring all of his research into this chat because he used coils and magnetic waves in some of his experiments and they don't apply to the lessons we are learning at this time.
(09:59:56) (ron1) sounds interesting for a later chat...perhaps
(10:00:08) (Cris) The fact that he brought quartz into medical practice as a tool is significant
(10:00:28) (Cris) Yes it would be an interesting presentation Ron
(10:01:28) (@gg) The next time someone asks me if I had ever heard of Marcel Vogel, guess what? I shall be able to tell with a resounding YES. Thanks to you Cris. This is truly interesting.
(10:01:48) (mabel) yes--it is fascinating
(10:02:16) (Cris) I thought you would enjoy hearing about someone of note working with quartz
(10:02:30) (~Blu) He was gifted!
(10:02:46) (merri) that he was!
(10:03:03) (merri) when did he pass, Cris?
(10:03:09) (Cris) At first he was convinced that the shape mattered more than the influence on the stones
(10:03:21) (Cris) Let me get my notes
(10:03:49) (@gg) Without the stone, why would any shape matter?
(10:03:56) (ron1) Bringing bac ancient Atlantean healing secrets...
(10:04:48) (Cris) He was born in 1917 and died in 1991
(10:05:11) (Cris) I think he was too Ron
(10:05:13) (~Blu) I would think it would have to do with focus Lory
(10:06:13) (Cris) If powered by a light source I think his shaped crystals might be used in something like a healing temple
(10:06:40) (Cris) lasers today passing through a crystal can heal or perform surgery
(10:06:59) (@gg) I wonder if that is why we see so many shaped crystals in the form of a pyramid?
(10:07:10) (Cris) In ancient times those crystals did everything from rejuvinate skin to remove illness
(10:07:25) (Cris) Some of that is to make money Lory
(10:07:45) (Cris) A lot of those are melted quartz formed that way
(10:08:26) (@gg) Well, actually money is only a tool and helps with prosperity and abundance. It really isn't evil if the intent is not evil.
(10:08:59) (Cris) It is the application of money not the having it
(10:09:07) (~Blu) fraud is fraud
(10:09:10) (ron1) gimme...oops, sorry
(10:09:17) (Cris) LOL
(10:09:31) (Cris) That is serious business
(10:09:43) (~Blu) yep
(10:09:54) (@gg) Of course, it is Cris. I did not mean to belittle the fact.
(10:10:14) (Cris) People who earn or inherit money that use it as a tool for helping others always get it back
(10:10:32) (@gg) The intent was not evil.
(10:10:44) (Cris) Anything sent out with love returns tenfold
(10:11:12) (Cris) I know you didn't mean it that way Lory
(10:11:14) (@gg) But but not always in the same form.
(10:11:29) (Cris) In the form you need it at that given time
(10:12:10) (Cris) This is a lot to think about so it is open chat if there are no questions
(10:12:36) (~Blu) TY Cris
(10:12:44) (merri) Didn't Cayce tell us about a large crystal used in Atlantis
(10:12:51) (MarkH) thank you Cris
(10:12:52) (ron1) very good Cris...
(10:12:54) (patricia) Cris, tell again how to clean and clear a crystal
(10:12:56) (mabel) Cris, is his work being continued today??
(10:12:58) (@gg) Thank you Cris. I am going to go practice with my hand full of milky crystals. LOVE to all.
(10:14:27) (Cris) You can clean you crystal in several ways. Under running water, burying it in sea salt, putting it in sunlight or moonlight or burying it in the ground
(10:14:28) (patricia) Yes, what mabel said. is anyone continuing his work?
(10:14:51) (patricia) okay thank you
(10:14:52) (Cris) I do not put mine in the gound I'd forget where I buried them
(10:15:04) (merri) LOL
(10:15:21) (Cris) Once it is cleared wash it under warm water with a mild soal and rinse completely
(10:15:29) (Cris) Then you can program it
(10:15:43) (patricia) okay, thanks
(10:26:12) (Cris) I'm glad everyone enjoyed the chat
(10:26:35) (~WalksInSpirit) It was great, Cris! Thank you so much!
(10:26:48) (Cris) This also shows how many quiet people in research are working with crystals
(10:26:56) (~Blu) These kind of people are inspiring
(10:27:28) (Cris) As I said in the beginning this man was noted for his work and held many patents
(10:28:27) (patricia) wouldn't you think that someone would carry on his work though?
(10:28:43) (Cris) It may be done by others
(10:29:03) (Cris) I know there are several research groups working with stones now
(10:29:18) (merri) I'm sure there are Pat....people have been working with crystals for a long time
(10:29:23) (Cris) One is at the Medical University of SC
(10:29:31) (patricia) yes, I suppose so. maybe we just haven't thought about it. As you say laser surgery is done with crystals
(10:29:45) (Cris) They came to the Columbia show last year to get quartz crystals
(10:29:57) (Cris) Usually ruby
(10:30:05) (patricia) WOW! how cool is that.
(10:30:08) (~Blu) cool
(10:31:02) (Cris) If word of alternate research were made public the university might lose some of its funding
(10:31:17) (~Blu) silly
(10:31:21) (Cris) That's why we don't hear about it in the paper
(10:32:19) (~Blu) Now if they thought they could use it as a weapon to make people sick in war they would be all over it
(10:32:23) (patricia) that IS silly.
(10:32:32) (patricia) right Blu
(10:32:41) (Cris) Native Americcans worked with stone before the Europeans settled here
(10:32:57) (Cris) I agree Blu
(10:33:32) (merri) isn't that what the Atlantean's did
(10:33:34) (Cris) Stones are still used for healing in many societies
(10:33:44) (merri) misused the great crystal
(10:33:57) (patricia) yes, Merri, that is what I thought.
(10:34:03) (~Blu) yes they did merri, but it was the Children Of Bael, not the Children Of The Law Of One
(10:34:05) (Cris) That caused the destruction of Atlantis
(10:34:33) (~Blu) the last great battle
(10:34:46) (patricia) Didn't the ancient Egyptians use stone in their temples of healing?
(10:34:57) (Cris) Yes they did
(10:35:27) (~Blu) yes pat, the survivors of Atlantis joined with the caucasians there, IE Cayce and used stones there too
(10:35:59) (~Blu) Cheops is actually a healing temple?
(10:36:12) (~Blu) anyway one of them was a healing temple
(10:37:03) (patricia) Isn't it strange how the belief in their healing powers is no longer a popular belief? In most scientific circles it would probably be scoffed at.
(10:37:07) (~Blu) I don't see how Cheops could actually be the temple now that I think about it
(10:37:50) (Cris) It is because of medical centers and drug companies teaching people that only they can heal
(10:37:58) (~Blu) good point
(10:38:29) (~Blu) and they don't focus on healing, they focus on relieving pain and keeping people sick...just a thought
(10:38:37) (~WalksInSpirit) Yep, all about the money, Cris.
(10:38:56) (Cris) I remember my mother and grandmother talking about visiting people with abilities doctors were a last resort except for childbirth
(10:38:56) (patricia) I suppose we have to have faith that in good time when the Creator is ready for a return of the practice of using stones as healing tools that it will happen.
(10:39:07) (~Blu) I am a little cynicle lately ;-D
(10:39:21) (merri) agree Blu and people are waking up to that fact and seeking alternatives more and more
(10:39:29) (~Blu) right
(10:39:57) (Cris) You go to a doctor and have to pay the deductible before they see you a lot of times now
(10:40:14) (patricia) Right Cris, it is all about the money.
(10:40:16) (Cris) They want the money upfront if you are uninsured
(10:40:59) (Cris) I have to be up early Blessings all
(10:41:11) (~Blu) blessings Cris
(10:41:21) (JohnB) nite Cris
(09:21:20) (Cris) Marcel Vogel did some interesting experiements with quartz
(09:21:45) (Cris) I am going to talk about his life and experiments a bit tonight
(09:22:33) (Cris) I'm going to get started
(09:22:50) (Cris) Lord and Protector of all please be with us on our spiritual journey as we seek a higher plane of thought. Let us see opportunity to work in your grace as we come together to seek peace in this world. Amen
(09:23:03) (@gg) Amen
(09:23:04) (patricia) Amen
(09:23:08) (~WalksInSpirit) Nunwe
(09:23:16) (~Blu) Amen
(09:23:22) (mabel) amen
(09:26:18) (Cris) This chat will tell a little about Marcel Vogel and his work. Some of his crystal cuts have proven that quartz has the ability to assist in the physical healing process. Later scientific experiments did show that some of his designs seem to facilitate healing under certain conditions.
(09:26:59) (Cris) Marcel Joseph Vogel, born in San Francisco in 1917, was revived after being pronounced dead at the age of six from pneumonia. At this time, Vogel encountered a near-death experience (NDE). It caused him to question the meaning of life. Every day, from the age of six, he walked to early morning Mass to pray and questioned the purpose of his existence.
(09:27:38) (Cris) At age 12, an answer came as a "voice" that told Marcel he would be a "phosphor chemist" doing work in luminescence. Majoring in chemistry and physics at the University of San Francisco, Vogel found little written, or taught, in the field of luminescence.
(09:28:09) (Cris) So he translated articles he found written in German on phosphors. Due to deteriorating health, he left college and completed his education privately, with Dr. Peter Pringsheim, a German professor.
(09:28:46) (Cris) Vogel published papers and formed his own corporation, Vogel Luminescence. The company pioneered in the manufacturing of fluorescent paints, oils, crayons, chalk, Day-Glo colors, invisible ink, and tagging and tracing powders—used to detect bacteria and disease, including cancer.
(09:29:12) (Cris) He worked part-time for IBM and he became a senior research scientist in 1957. He remained with IBM until 1984, when he founded his own lab, Psychic Research, Inc.
(09:29:32) (Cris) I am giving his background so you realize the man was not a crackpot
(09:29:44) (~Blu) cool guy
(09:29:52) (Raleigh) :)
(09:30:06) (Cris) He was very interesting and so was his work
(09:30:23) (Cris) During the time he was employed with IBM he received numerous patents for his inventions. Among these was the magnetic coating for the 24†hard disc drive systems. He also worked with the first liquid crystal displays, or LCD, and researched the effect of the mind and emotion on plants.
(09:31:01) (Cris) He eventually began to use raw, single terminated quartz crystals. By pointing the crystal at another person, he discovered that the crystal amplified thoughts and emotions, often putting the individual into an altered state of consciousness.
(09:31:47) (Cris) Vogel's work with human & plant communication experiments led to his discovery of an intelligent matrix existing in crystal/liquid crystal with an ability to store, amplify, and transfer information, and that crystal can be altered during its growth stage.
(09:32:00) (merri) what is "terminated" quartz crystals?
(09:32:12) (patricia) point
(09:32:24) (Cris) pointed at the end the natural growth to a point
(09:32:33) (merri) TY
(09:32:53) (Cris) some crystals have a single termination or point some are double terminated at both ends
(09:33:40) (Cris) pointed at both ends naturally these are free floating in the ground or in pockets at times
(09:34:08) (Cris) Seventeen years of research in this area led to his faceted crystal inventions, useful in laser applications. Vogel was also working on the structuring of water for purification purposes, and the structuring of wines to rapidly age them.
(09:35:32) (Cris) I have a lot of information on his water and wine experiments but it would take several sessions to do it justice. He purified them with crystals, thought, magnetic forces etc.
(09:35:50) (Cris) For tonight we are focusing on his crystals
(09:36:41) (Cris) The above experiments were not simply crystal programming they involved other applications
(09:36:59) (Cris) After leaving IBM, Vogel continued his research on the use of quartz crystals and their ability to heal people. He founded a group dedicated to intensive research into healing energies, especially those of various shapes of quartz crystals.
(09:38:41) (Cris) He cut a lot of quartz, not always crystals in to various shapes to see which might heal better. One piece I read said he also melted quartz and reshaped it. Another practice that is appearing recently on the market
(09:39:01) (Cris) Vogel knew that the real origin of illness is in the etheric body. Although the body or emotions sustain a trauma, the etheric body holds the memory of physical or emotional injury and it can become stagnant, distorted, or stuck. The result of this unstable or blocked energy is illness. He discovered that crystals are the common thread in healing that ties together energy, illness, and problems in the etheric body.
(09:39:46) (Cris) Whenever light from the higher realms comes into a person's body, the light gets refracted if the etheric body is not stable. This can cause illness. The Vogel cut crystal is supposed to give the user immediate access to the etheric body and stabilizes it, allowing light from the higher realms to enter.
(09:40:13) (@gg) How interesting.
(09:40:24) (Raleigh) no kidden
(09:40:29) (patricia) Yes, very
(09:40:41) (mabel) what kind of cut is it?
(09:40:46) (Raleigh) ive not heard of melting quartz either /
(09:40:52) (Cris) Some healers says his quartz cuts work very well others say it is in the quartz programming
(09:41:18) (Cris) It is done in labs to create perfectly shaped crystals Ral
(09:41:27) (Raleigh) k
(09:41:35) (Cris) Those in nature have growth marks and small flaws
(09:41:57) (Cris) These crystals are not cheap prices for the small size healing crystals, approximately 3 inches in length, and 1.5 inches across, range from $450 to $600. Over the years the Vogel cut crystals have climbed in price as demands for them from healers have increased. There are many sites that sell these and other Vogel designed crystals for hige sums of money
(09:42:29) (MarkH) our commom drinking glass's is made of quartz?
(09:42:33) (merri) WoW
(09:43:11) (Cris) I admire Vogels work and think he was truly on to something when he passed on
(09:43:36) (mabel) is his work being carried on now?
(09:43:41) (Cris) His work at that time began to put the accent on programming rather than cut or shape
(09:43:56) (~WalksInSpirit) Glassware is lead crystal instead of quartz crystal, ennit?
(09:44:16) (merri) so why the high price for the cut crystal
(09:44:23) (Cris) Glass is made from sand and a lot of that is quartz
(09:44:57) (MarkH) so we can program our glass ware
(09:45:03) (MarkH) maybe
(09:45:06) (Cris) Specialty shape and a limited suply to keep the price artifically high
(09:45:07) (merri) LOL
(09:45:19) (Cris) I wouldn't try Mark
(09:45:28) (Cris) Do they actually work better than a plain crystal? Some healers and scientists argue that any quartz matching the vibrations of the person using them show the same effects. Reiki and Healing Touch practitioners using both plain and Vogel crystals think that the programming of the crystal is what matters in working with their patients.
(09:46:01) (Cris) Even Vogel was beginning to waver on the shape at the end
(09:46:22) (Raleigh) i will need see his work for sure / i had fun trying to figure out the shape of the atlantean firestone /
(09:46:31) (Cris) The company making the Vogel cut disagree they say that cutting quartz to these dimensions produces an instrument that has the same vibration as structured water. That this is highly significant because human bodies are composed primarily of water. This makes the Vogel Wand a powerful and effective healing tool.
(09:47:17) (Cris) The Vogel crystal is programmed by those using it
(09:47:23) (merri) well naturally they would say that
(09:47:36) (merri) at 450 a shot!
(09:47:56) (mabel) alot of money for a crystal
(09:47:56) (Cris) although Vogel himself called it a slightly different thing.
(09:48:03) (Cris) Yes it is
(09:48:16) (Cris) In my own experience of becoming a Reiki practitioner and using stones for healing I have noted that many things affect the quality and the speed of healing. The most important is the person's desire to be healed. The second is keeping myself as a clear channel for the healing energy to come through.
(09:48:32) (ron1) hinders a needed oportunity at such a price...
(09:49:01) (Cris) Agree Ron
(09:49:18) (Cris) When I use quartz crystals of any kind, clear, amethyst, milky or smoky it is important that these stones were properly cleared, cleaned and programmed before using them on someone desiring a treatment. I haven't felt that specific cuts enhance the process at this time. Edgar Cayce didn't advocate specific cuts in his readings. However, it could be because these specific cuts came after his passing.
(09:49:58) (Cris) Or because as he stressed it is the vibration of the stone
(09:50:07) (@gg) It would seem to me that the natural crystal would be more effective.
(09:50:21) (Raleigh) thats what i think too gg
(09:50:24) (Cris) I feel it is the vibration working with the body that matters more than shape
(09:50:34) (Cris) I do too Lory
(09:50:45) (Cris) As a rockhound I am very familiar with the need of dealers to recoup their expenses in setting up a shop or a booth at a show. They lovingly display machine cut wands of quartz, fluorite or feldspar touting their healing abilities. The buyer should be aware that you are buying the stones for their vibrations not their cuts.
(09:51:52) (Cris) I do not discount the findings of Marcel Vogel because he held over 100 patents in his name and was known for his creativity. During the eulogy given at his funeral this was said about him:
(09:52:30) (Cris) From a fellow researcher: I was one of a group of 16 physicians privileged to work with him over a number of years with body energies, especially the capacity to focus healing energies with crystals in the treatment of illness. All of us had an extensive background in acupuncture and appreciated the ability to manipulate body energies.
(09:53:06) (Cris) Under Marcel's guidance, some of us began to learn the process of transmitting thought, especially loving thoughts, unconditionally, to our patients. It brought us an even greater capacity to appreciate the power of the mind to influence illness, the power both to heal and exacerbate disease. And, most important all, to appreciate the incredible presence of unconditional love and it's capacity to trigger transformative shifts
(09:54:00) (Cris) Marcel served for me as a spiritual mentor. He was a truly devout, yet iconoclast Catholic with a passionate love for Christ, and whose devotion was part of his very breathing. Yet he embraced with a deep understanding the teaching the Eastern religions with an especial love and admiration for the Lord Buddha.
(09:54:22) (Cris) He possessed the ability to see beyond the confines and formal structure of church teaching to appreciate the underlying principles in all devout religions. Marcel would have been just as comfortable in a Tibetan monastery as he was in this Church. And just as comfortable and compatible in the presence of the Dalai Lama as he would in the presence of the Pope.
(09:54:51) (Cris) Marcel emphasized the power of meditation to heal and guide our lives
(09:55:09) (Cris) The above speaks volumes about this man who brought crystals to the attention of the scientific world. Even in the eulogy the doctor who worked with him speaks of using the mind to influence matter - programming the crystals. I am not discouraging anyone from trying them but you should keep a journal as I do to compare your results.
(09:56:18) (Cris) The healing stones that I have bought commercially do not work any better or faster than the natural crystals most of us can collect
(09:56:28) (@gg) The programming baffles me a bit, Cris. Why would not prayer asking for a blessing, be sufficient?
(09:56:56) (@gg) Or is that part of the programming of which you speak?
(09:56:59) (Cris) It can be Lory because I pray when I program my crystals to work for the highest good
(09:57:24) (Cris) If it is not for the highest good it will rebound to you
(09:57:38) (Cris) See the above statements saying that Marcel Vogel taught the physicians to pass on unconditional loving thoughts to their patients. Marcel also used thoughts to do what he called influence (program) his quartz crystals
(09:57:46) (@gg) As do all things that are of the Universe and God.
(09:58:12) (Cris) Using thoughts to influence and programing are two ways of saying the same thing
(09:58:26) (Cris) Marcel Vogel's experiences with quartz and water show that the crystals can be a purifying agent. His experiments demonstrated that structure of quartz can replicate itself in water. Something we did with both the rose quartz and amethyst pebbles.
(09:58:54) (Cris) We did those experiments as a group earlier this year
(09:59:12) (Cris) I did not bring all of his research into this chat because he used coils and magnetic waves in some of his experiments and they don't apply to the lessons we are learning at this time.
(09:59:56) (ron1) sounds interesting for a later chat...perhaps
(10:00:08) (Cris) The fact that he brought quartz into medical practice as a tool is significant
(10:00:28) (Cris) Yes it would be an interesting presentation Ron
(10:01:28) (@gg) The next time someone asks me if I had ever heard of Marcel Vogel, guess what? I shall be able to tell with a resounding YES. Thanks to you Cris. This is truly interesting.
(10:01:48) (mabel) yes--it is fascinating
(10:02:16) (Cris) I thought you would enjoy hearing about someone of note working with quartz
(10:02:30) (~Blu) He was gifted!
(10:02:46) (merri) that he was!
(10:03:03) (merri) when did he pass, Cris?
(10:03:09) (Cris) At first he was convinced that the shape mattered more than the influence on the stones
(10:03:21) (Cris) Let me get my notes
(10:03:49) (@gg) Without the stone, why would any shape matter?
(10:03:56) (ron1) Bringing bac ancient Atlantean healing secrets...
(10:04:48) (Cris) He was born in 1917 and died in 1991
(10:05:11) (Cris) I think he was too Ron
(10:05:13) (~Blu) I would think it would have to do with focus Lory
(10:06:13) (Cris) If powered by a light source I think his shaped crystals might be used in something like a healing temple
(10:06:40) (Cris) lasers today passing through a crystal can heal or perform surgery
(10:06:59) (@gg) I wonder if that is why we see so many shaped crystals in the form of a pyramid?
(10:07:10) (Cris) In ancient times those crystals did everything from rejuvinate skin to remove illness
(10:07:25) (Cris) Some of that is to make money Lory
(10:07:45) (Cris) A lot of those are melted quartz formed that way
(10:08:26) (@gg) Well, actually money is only a tool and helps with prosperity and abundance. It really isn't evil if the intent is not evil.
(10:08:59) (Cris) It is the application of money not the having it
(10:09:07) (~Blu) fraud is fraud
(10:09:10) (ron1) gimme...oops, sorry
(10:09:17) (Cris) LOL
(10:09:31) (Cris) That is serious business
(10:09:43) (~Blu) yep
(10:09:54) (@gg) Of course, it is Cris. I did not mean to belittle the fact.
(10:10:14) (Cris) People who earn or inherit money that use it as a tool for helping others always get it back
(10:10:32) (@gg) The intent was not evil.
(10:10:44) (Cris) Anything sent out with love returns tenfold
(10:11:12) (Cris) I know you didn't mean it that way Lory
(10:11:14) (@gg) But but not always in the same form.
(10:11:29) (Cris) In the form you need it at that given time
(10:12:10) (Cris) This is a lot to think about so it is open chat if there are no questions
(10:12:36) (~Blu) TY Cris
(10:12:44) (merri) Didn't Cayce tell us about a large crystal used in Atlantis
(10:12:51) (MarkH) thank you Cris
(10:12:52) (ron1) very good Cris...
(10:12:54) (patricia) Cris, tell again how to clean and clear a crystal
(10:12:56) (mabel) Cris, is his work being continued today??
(10:12:58) (@gg) Thank you Cris. I am going to go practice with my hand full of milky crystals. LOVE to all.
(10:14:27) (Cris) You can clean you crystal in several ways. Under running water, burying it in sea salt, putting it in sunlight or moonlight or burying it in the ground
(10:14:28) (patricia) Yes, what mabel said. is anyone continuing his work?
(10:14:51) (patricia) okay thank you
(10:14:52) (Cris) I do not put mine in the gound I'd forget where I buried them
(10:15:04) (merri) LOL
(10:15:21) (Cris) Once it is cleared wash it under warm water with a mild soal and rinse completely
(10:15:29) (Cris) Then you can program it
(10:15:43) (patricia) okay, thanks
(10:26:12) (Cris) I'm glad everyone enjoyed the chat
(10:26:35) (~WalksInSpirit) It was great, Cris! Thank you so much!
(10:26:48) (Cris) This also shows how many quiet people in research are working with crystals
(10:26:56) (~Blu) These kind of people are inspiring
(10:27:28) (Cris) As I said in the beginning this man was noted for his work and held many patents
(10:28:27) (patricia) wouldn't you think that someone would carry on his work though?
(10:28:43) (Cris) It may be done by others
(10:29:03) (Cris) I know there are several research groups working with stones now
(10:29:18) (merri) I'm sure there are Pat....people have been working with crystals for a long time
(10:29:23) (Cris) One is at the Medical University of SC
(10:29:31) (patricia) yes, I suppose so. maybe we just haven't thought about it. As you say laser surgery is done with crystals
(10:29:45) (Cris) They came to the Columbia show last year to get quartz crystals
(10:29:57) (Cris) Usually ruby
(10:30:05) (patricia) WOW! how cool is that.
(10:30:08) (~Blu) cool
(10:31:02) (Cris) If word of alternate research were made public the university might lose some of its funding
(10:31:17) (~Blu) silly
(10:31:21) (Cris) That's why we don't hear about it in the paper
(10:32:19) (~Blu) Now if they thought they could use it as a weapon to make people sick in war they would be all over it
(10:32:23) (patricia) that IS silly.
(10:32:32) (patricia) right Blu
(10:32:41) (Cris) Native Americcans worked with stone before the Europeans settled here
(10:32:57) (Cris) I agree Blu
(10:33:32) (merri) isn't that what the Atlantean's did
(10:33:34) (Cris) Stones are still used for healing in many societies
(10:33:44) (merri) misused the great crystal
(10:33:57) (patricia) yes, Merri, that is what I thought.
(10:34:03) (~Blu) yes they did merri, but it was the Children Of Bael, not the Children Of The Law Of One
(10:34:05) (Cris) That caused the destruction of Atlantis
(10:34:33) (~Blu) the last great battle
(10:34:46) (patricia) Didn't the ancient Egyptians use stone in their temples of healing?
(10:34:57) (Cris) Yes they did
(10:35:27) (~Blu) yes pat, the survivors of Atlantis joined with the caucasians there, IE Cayce and used stones there too
(10:35:59) (~Blu) Cheops is actually a healing temple?
(10:36:12) (~Blu) anyway one of them was a healing temple
(10:37:03) (patricia) Isn't it strange how the belief in their healing powers is no longer a popular belief? In most scientific circles it would probably be scoffed at.
(10:37:07) (~Blu) I don't see how Cheops could actually be the temple now that I think about it
(10:37:50) (Cris) It is because of medical centers and drug companies teaching people that only they can heal
(10:37:58) (~Blu) good point
(10:38:29) (~Blu) and they don't focus on healing, they focus on relieving pain and keeping people sick...just a thought
(10:38:37) (~WalksInSpirit) Yep, all about the money, Cris.
(10:38:56) (Cris) I remember my mother and grandmother talking about visiting people with abilities doctors were a last resort except for childbirth
(10:38:56) (patricia) I suppose we have to have faith that in good time when the Creator is ready for a return of the practice of using stones as healing tools that it will happen.
(10:39:07) (~Blu) I am a little cynicle lately ;-D
(10:39:21) (merri) agree Blu and people are waking up to that fact and seeking alternatives more and more
(10:39:29) (~Blu) right
(10:39:57) (Cris) You go to a doctor and have to pay the deductible before they see you a lot of times now
(10:40:14) (patricia) Right Cris, it is all about the money.
(10:40:16) (Cris) They want the money upfront if you are uninsured
(10:40:59) (Cris) I have to be up early Blessings all
(10:41:11) (~Blu) blessings Cris
(10:41:21) (JohnB) nite Cris